WPA ACHA College Club Hockey

[Saucey]

24 minutes ago, Danner27 said:

Completely missing my point, obviously you didn’t look to see how many pa kids are paying out of state tuition to play in an example such as the state of ohio (small example at that). 

I think you missed my point. The Pa schools are EXPENSIVE. Even factoring in our of state tuition, a lot of Ohio schools offer enough in aid to be comparable to or less expensive than Pa schools. Has nothing to do with hockey politics. Maybe you know one family that got shafted. I sincerely doubt it is the wide swath you want to paint.

[Danner27]

1 hour ago, Saucey said:

I think you missed my point. The Pa schools are EXPENSIVE. Even factoring in our of state tuition, a lot of Ohio schools offer enough in aid to be comparable to or less expensive than Pa schools. Has nothing to do with hockey politics. Maybe you know one family that got shafted. I sincerely doubt it is the wide swath you want to paint.

It is. 
 

yes, pa schools & college in general are at an all time high but the Ohio (or any out of state) schools don’t give up enough money to leave the state and have a similar cost comparison. It’s much more expensive to leave PA for college, this is due to PA passing a law in 2020. PA also doesn’t fund its own state schools enough imo. 

[fafa fohi]

26 minutes ago, Danner27 said:

It is. 
 

yes, pa schools & college in general are at an all time high but the Ohio (or any out of state) schools don’t give up enough money to leave the state and have a similar cost comparison. It’s much more expensive to leave PA for college, this is due to PA passing a law in 2020. PA also doesn’t fund its own state schools enough imo. 

You are 100% incorrect. As I mentioned before, OH schools are extremely generous with numerous scholarship opportunities to lure out of state kids to their schools. My oldest graduated from OU last year and we paid considerably less that what it would have cost for him to go to PItt or Penn State.
 

The only schools that were cheaper were SRU, IUP and West Chester and not by much. On top of that he played intramural hockey there for three years just to keep himself in the game.

Sorry, but you’re wrong. 

[sarampage]

Definitely true in Ohio...my son has excellent grades / very good SAT/ACTs and Pitt/PSU offered nothing based on merit. He was offered over half tuition from a few Ohio schools where the tuition is $45-50K/ year, so it's comparable and sometimes less money to go out of state.

[Danner27]

PSU is such a bad example, they have so many applications they don’t give out much. PITT is starting to get to that level from what I’m told. looking at niche you can see schools like iup, sru, cal, etc are all around 15k a year after aid. Ohio U is showing 33k for out of state after aid, Miami is 35k, Kent state is 25k. (These are averages)

local private schools in pa are all over the place. Mercyhurst is showing 35k after aid, rmu 25k.  
 

Wvu shows an average out of state price of 35k. 

These prices do not take into consideration the students federal loans as more “aid”. 

@fafa fohi what did it cost on average a year for your kid at OU ? friend in Ohio who’s kid is graduating this year pays 24k a year in state. 

[fafa fohi]

39 minutes ago, Danner27 said:

PSU is such a bad example, they have so many applications they don’t give out much. PITT is starting to get to that level from what I’m told. looking at niche you can see schools like iup, sru, cal, etc are all around 15k a year after aid. Ohio U is showing 33k for out of state after aid, Miami is 35k, Kent state is 25k. (These are averages)

local private schools in pa are all over the place. Mercyhurst is showing 35k after aid, rmu 25k.  
 

Wvu shows an average out of state price of 35k. 

These prices do not take into consideration the students federal loans as more “aid”. 

@fafa fohi what did it cost on average a year for your kid at OU ? friend in Ohio who’s kid is graduating this year pays 24k a year in state. 

Paid roughly $25K a year which included room, meal plans and tuition.  Low interest government loans cap out at $5,500 per year, $22K tops over four years. 
 

The better the grades the more money that’s available in scholarships.  Penn State all in is around $38K per year and I knew a kid that had a 4.4 GPA out of high school and didn’t get a dime from them in merit money.  He also applied to Bowling Green and said his out of pocket cost would have been around $22K a year.  His dad was a Penn State grad so I don’t have to tell you where he ended up. 

Edited March 10, 2023 by fafa fohi

[Danner27]

3 minutes ago, fafa fohi said:

Paid roughly $25K a year which included room, meal plans and tuition.  Low interest government loans cap out at $5,500 per year, $22K tops. 
 

The better the grades the more money that’s available in scholarships.  Penn State all in is around $38K per year and I knew a kid that had a 4.4 GPA out of high school and didn’t get a dime from them in merit money.  He also applied to Bowling Green and said his out of pocket cost would have been around $22K a year.  His dad was a Penn State grad so I don’t have to tell you where he ended up. 

PSU is crazy. What you’ve posted I’ve been hearing for a few years. People getting into debt (or paying) over 120K for a undergrad degree. 
 

in your case, it still cost you and your son 100k for an undergrad. I’ve got a friend who’s kid graduated from miami, 5 years to get his business BA - 146k. He’s regretting let the kid go there, wanted him to stay in state (Michigan). It was completely a club hockey decesion. Sure, the kid had a blast playing but now between the kids federal loans and the parent loans they are trying to figure out how to pay them off. It’s not sounding good. 
 

One of my kids (never played sports) is graduating from clarion. It ended up costing 14k a year while he was living on campus, the last two years he had an apartment with some friends - the cost dropped to 9k a year with his rent. 
 

Now we are going way off topic - even my kid at a state school such as clarion paying 46k for an undergrad is a lot of money but this brings me back around to the topic in a way -  kids picking a college solely based off club hockey, on campus rinks etc - it’s nuts. You can see when parents are spending that kind of money how the politics start to creep in, going back to the topic I suppose. 

[miked]

14K a year for Clarion (aka PennWest)? I was just at Edinboro (aka Penn West) last Friday with my son and they showed us the breakdown at 12k a year for tuition, 22k all in a year.

So i'm not going to try to tell you what you paid, but seems prices may have changed. So if your choice is 22k for no hockey, or 25k for Bobcat hockey, seems pretty worth it, provided the kid can actually make the team. 

and with stats like this 

According to the National Center for Education Statistics, one-third of all U.S. college students switch majors before earning a bachelor's degree. And around 1 in 10 students changes majors more than once.

According to the National Student Clearinghouse, around one-third of college students transfer schools before earning their degree.

not to mention how many people get jobs unrelated to their degree or after working in their field for a few years change careers entirely.

You pick a school that is the best fit for YOUR family. if that includes hockey or not, it's only YOUR business. Whether the school is in state or out of state is YOUR business. I know kids that went to school in Colorado just to go to school in Colorado, So what? their business, not mine.

If everybody is so concerned about everyone else's education costs the advice that should be given is go to community college, get an associates degree. Transfer to a 4 year university with a transfer agreement with your community college. the associate degree gets you a 20% tuition discount on your remaining 2 years. Graduate with an associates degree and a bachelors degree with minimal debt relatively speaking. 

if your kid wants to go to a school to play club hockey, do it. chances are they will be more engaged and less likely to be part of this stat

30% of students drop out in the first year. Only 41% of students graduate in 4 years. Male students have a 20% higher chance to drop out, than female students. Asian students have the lowest dropout rate.

[stickboy]

If I’m an employer looking at a stack of resumes from applicants from PSU, PItt, OU, Miami, Kent, Akron, IUP, SRU, etc. I know how I am initially sorting them (meaning some at the bottom may never get looked at). There is a reason why some schools cost more and don’t hand out aid. Their degrees are more valuable when it’s all said and done.  It’s all still overpriced IMO, but that’s a different discussion.  Save for college and pick a degree that’s in demand and a school that is good at placing graduates in the field you want a career. 

[Danner27]

2 hours ago, miked said:

14K a year for Clarion (aka PennWest)? I was just at Edinboro (aka Penn West) last Friday with my son and they showed us the breakdown at 12k a year for tuition, 22k all in a year.

So i'm not going to try to tell you what you paid, but seems prices may have changed. So if your choice is 22k for no hockey, or 25k for Bobcat hockey, seems pretty worth it, provided the kid can actually make the team. 

and with stats like this 

According to the National Center for Education Statistics, one-third of all U.S. college students switch majors before earning a bachelor's degree. And around 1 in 10 students changes majors more than once.

According to the National Student Clearinghouse, around one-third of college students transfer schools before earning their degree.

not to mention how many people get jobs unrelated to their degree or after working in their field for a few years change careers entirely.

You pick a school that is the best fit for YOUR family. if that includes hockey or not, it's only YOUR business. Whether the school is in state or out of state is YOUR business. I know kids that went to school in Colorado just to go to school in Colorado, So what? their business, not mine.

If everybody is so concerned about everyone else's education costs the advice that should be given is go to community college, get an associates degree. Transfer to a 4 year university with a transfer agreement with your community college. the associate degree gets you a 20% tuition discount on your remaining 2 years. Graduate with an associates degree and a bachelors degree with minimal debt relatively speaking. 

if your kid wants to go to a school to play club hockey, do it. chances are they will be more engaged and less likely to be part of this stat

30% of students drop out in the first year. Only 41% of students graduate in 4 years. Male students have a 20% higher chance to drop out, than female students. Asian students have the lowest dropout rate.

If I recall correctly the total cost was around 19k a year before scholarships and grants. This is my child that doesn’t play any sports, his aid package was grandfathered in before the merger. 

[Danner27]

52 minutes ago, stickboy said:

If I’m an employer looking at a stack of resumes from applicants from PSU, PItt, OU, Miami, Kent, Akron, IUP, SRU, etc. I know how I am initially sorting them (meaning some at the bottom may never get looked at). There is a reason why some schools cost more and don’t hand out aid. Their degrees are more valuable when it’s all said and done.  It’s all still overpriced IMO, but that’s a different discussion.  Save for college and pick a degree that’s in demand and a school that is good at placing graduates in the field you want a career. 

I can tell you as someone who’s job was to find the right candidates before I started my own company - I didn’t care where the person got their degree - the interview, how they presented, their demeanor along with knowledge defined my criteria for who I sent up the ladder. In this day & age, it doesn’t matter much were you get your BA/BS unless you are in something specialized. The previous head of HR for my previous company (who I didn’t higher) went to community college AS - slippery rock BA, she got her masters while employeed by said company (I think it was rmu I was already gone at this point) but now she works for Boeing. Point is - when it comes to an undergrad, not many care unless they are an alum from the school. It’s about what the person learned, not where they went. 

[Danner27]

2 hours ago, miked said:

14K a year for Clarion (aka PennWest)? I was just at Edinboro (aka Penn West) last Friday with my son and they showed us the breakdown at 12k a year for tuition, 22k all in a year.

So i'm not going to try to tell you what you paid, but seems prices may have changed. So if your choice is 22k for no hockey, or 25k for Bobcat hockey, seems pretty worth it, provided the kid can actually make the team. 

and with stats like this 

According to the National Center for Education Statistics, one-third of all U.S. college students switch majors before earning a bachelor's degree. And around 1 in 10 students changes majors more than once.

According to the National Student Clearinghouse, around one-third of college students transfer schools before earning their degree.

not to mention how many people get jobs unrelated to their degree or after working in their field for a few years change careers entirely.

You pick a school that is the best fit for YOUR family. if that includes hockey or not, it's only YOUR business. Whether the school is in state or out of state is YOUR business. I know kids that went to school in Colorado just to go to school in Colorado, So what? their business, not mine.

If everybody is so concerned about everyone else's education costs the advice that should be given is go to community college, get an associates degree. Transfer to a 4 year university with a transfer agreement with your community college. the associate degree gets you a 20% tuition discount on your remaining 2 years. Graduate with an associates degree and a bachelors degree with minimal debt relatively speaking. 

if your kid wants to go to a school to play club hockey, do it. chances are they will be more engaged and less likely to be part of this stat

30% of students drop out in the first year. Only 41% of students graduate in 4 years. Male students have a 20% higher chance to drop out, than female students. Asian students have the lowest dropout rate.

PS - read my reply above about the pervious head of HR for my previous company. Very similar to what you are saying. 
 

I would like to add, we know plenty of kids that went to a school for club hockey only to drop out or fail out in a year or two. One is a master plumber now making more money then me lol

[BeaverFalls]

Wrong topic

 

Edited March 10, 2023 by BeaverFalls
Wrong topic

[miked]

1 hour ago, Danner27 said:

If I recall correctly the total cost was around 19k a year before scholarships and grants. This is my child that doesn’t play any sports, his aid package was grandfathered in before the merger. 

ah, i was thinking that seemed like a crazy price bump over 4 years. 

[miked]

1 hour ago, Danner27 said:

PS - read my reply above about the pervious head of HR for my previous company. Very similar to what you are saying. 
 

I would like to add, we know plenty of kids that went to a school for club hockey only to drop out or fail out in a year or two. One is a master plumber now making more money then me lol

exactly, so why isn't picking a school based on hockey vaild? with all the twists and turns that life is going to throw at an 18 year old what do they know? as another poster wrote, they found the school that was the best fit for them. what made it the best fit? for some kids and their family, the hockey might make it the best fit. it might not. whatever is going to make your kid comfortable and happy is most likely going to lead to a better chance of success. 

[Law]

#23 IUP plays #15 Illinois St on 3/16 @ 4:45. IUP defeated Duquesne 3-2 in OT in semis and RMU 6-2 in CHMA finals. It's been a great season for the boys and I wish them luck at Nationals. #12 Pitt plays #5 Liberty on 3/18 @ 10:15. PITT won the ESCHL regular season championship to secure auto bid and beat #18 Stonybrook 4-2 in semis and #10 Niagara 8-2 in finals of ESCHL playoffs. An example of the problem with awarding the auto bid to a leagues playoff winner is #58 Buffalo having a magical weekend and winning the auto bid in the NECHL. You're not getting the best team from your league representing your conference. Nationals are in Marlborough, Mass.

[Eddie Shore]

20 hours ago, miked said:

exactly, so why isn't picking a school based on hockey vaild? with all the twists and turns that life is going to throw at an 18 year old what do they know? as another poster wrote, they found the school that was the best fit for them. what made it the best fit? for some kids and their family, the hockey might make it the best fit. it might not. whatever is going to make your kid comfortable and happy is most likely going to lead to a better chance of success. 

Pick a school that will provide a good education and look good on a resume.  College is for an education, even club hockey coaches will tell you that.  Any club player will tell you they are playing for the brotherhood, to stay in shape and the joy they get from playing.  At the end of the day you will do what you want, just saying that after graduation hockey pretty much ends, for college play for the enjoyment but grade’s always come first 

[Law]

Great post Eddie! You nailed it.

[hockedude]

On 3/10/2023 at 1:22 PM, Law said:

#23 IUP plays #15 Illinois St on 3/16 @ 4:45. IUP defeated Duquesne 3-2 in OT in semis and RMU 6-2 in CHMA finals. It's been a great season for the boys and I wish them luck at Nationals. #12 Pitt plays #5 Liberty on 3/18 @ 10:15. PITT won the ESCHL regular season championship to secure auto bid and beat #18 Stonybrook 4-2 in semis and #10 Niagara 8-2 in finals of ESCHL playoffs. An example of the problem with awarding the auto bid to a leagues playoff winner is #58 Buffalo having a magical weekend and winning the auto bid in the NECHL. You're not getting the best team from your league representing your conference. Nationals are in Marlborough, Mass.

I like the autobid going to the playoff winner. Creates a little more excitement for playoffs, and gives it those march madness vibes. There should be more benefit to the teams in first place in leagues though. CHMA did pretty well this year with that, allowing IUP, the 1 seed to pick who they wanted to play in the semis

[Danner27]

Iup got blown out 9-1 in their first game, sent home. Same with Pitt with their top 12 ranking - 7-2 final. Liberty was up 7-1 in the second, liberty put their second goalie in, rested their top players. 

 

 

[Pa Hockey]

9 minutes ago, Danner27 said:

Iup got blown out 9-1 in their first game, sent home. Same with Pitt with their top 12 ranking - 7-2 final. Liberty was up 7-1 in the second, liberty put their second goalie in, rested their top players. 

 

 

Danner

IUP game was 3-0- after 2 and ISU scored 5 on backup goalie

            Pitt outshot Liberty as well

            Top ACHA Schools are at higher level and local schools are not top 10-15 caliber yet 

 

 

[Danner27]

7 hours ago, Pa Hockey said:

Danner

IUP game was 3-0- after 2 and ISU scored 5 on backup goalie

            Pitt outshot Liberty as well

            Top ACHA Schools are at higher level and local schools are not top 10-15 caliber yet 

 

 

Could of, should of, would of. 
 

but I do agree with you, it was the point I made earlier in this thread. Our western pa acha clubs can not compete with those real top ranked teams. It’s not a slight, it’s a reality. Just look at the skating ability alone, it’s not close. 

ps - whomever was running the clock for that pitt game was lost, they were counting anything that looked like a shot including 3 that sailed over the net. 
 

 

[aaaahockey]

32 minutes ago, Danner27 said:

 

ps - whomever was running the clock for that pitt game was lost, they were counting anything that looked like a shot including 3 that sailed over the net. 
 

 

Sometimes a few beers helps settle the nerves 

[Happy Hockey Fan]

Until local ACHA team fill their rosters with kids that played juniors and come in as 21 year old freshmen and offer free or close to free hockey it will be tough for them to compete against the top teams that do. 
 

Local teams have more and more kids that aged out in juniors. But the top teams are filled with kids that have aged out of juniors, and some of those kids have played in some of the higher level junior leagues. The maturity of those teams make a difference. 
 

If it cost $2000 to play at one university(what I believe is what the average local ACHA player pays), but another university with comparable educational qualifications and tuition says they want you to go to their school and play hockey for free it obviously gives a big advantage to one of those schools. 
 

Local teams are very good in my opinion. But it will always be tough for them to compete at nationals until they can recruit like the top ACHA schools can. And in until they can fill their rosters with 21 year old freshmen, it will be hard to compete as well. 

[hockeyisgreat]

Danner, what do we know about Chatham?  Is it a good program?  I know they are D-3 and don't offer athletic scholarships, but is the level of competition good?  How would they stack up against Pitt, Duquesne or IUP?  Just curious! Also will RMU be back next year?  Haven't heard anything about them.  I see that Chatham plays their home games at Hunt Armory. Haven't been there yet.  Will it continue to be a thing for the winter months only?