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Ihearthockey

The way too early pre-season "rankings"

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We all know how the WPA hockey truths, rumors and opinions circulate like wildfire.  What are some thoughts on teams that will take division titles this year based on player movements (whether through attrition or addition).  

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The Bantam birth year team at NP is a good group hockey players. Will be interested in where they play and how they do.

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I had heard of at least two orgs were short on 05 talent and in lieu of having an 05 BY team they went with an 05/06 mixed team..........anyone know if this is true or not?  

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6 minutes ago, fafa fohi said:

I had heard of at least two orgs were short on 05 talent and in lieu of having an 05 BY team they went with an 05/06 mixed team..........anyone know if this is true or not?  

South Hills for one is set up that way and would have to assume that as well with the Predators with the 05 team in place.

At the end of the day, the 05 birth year is weak in terms of numbers and too many teams, especially with the third 'A' to populate quality through to the AA level.

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NP had it set up for the 05 to be BY and the 06 to be BY. It was that way until the third night of try outs when it was rumored that the 05 team would be mixed.

 

I have no insight to the how or why.

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30 minutes ago, Chinstrap said:

NP had it set up for the 05 to be BY and the 06 to be BY. It was that way until the third night of try outs when it was rumored that the 05 team would be mixed.

 

I have no insight to the how or why.

The way it was explained to me was that 2 06 kids made the 05 team.  So, the 06 team is an 06 team but it is without two of their better players.

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More 05s exited the hockey travel scene this year. A few I heard about who were cut from Pens are just playing their school teams. Maybe next year when the Pens go to one team PAHL will pick up some more.

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7 hours ago, Saucey said:

More 05s exited the hockey travel scene this year. A few I heard about who were cut from Pens are just playing their school teams. Maybe next year when the Pens go to one team PAHL will pick up some more.

I have heard the same.  One parent I spoke to whose son was cut by PPE said in not so many words that PAHL AA was beneath them and their son would only play for his school.  Pretty pompous if you ask me.  

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39 minutes ago, powderfinger said:

PAHL AA is beneath them but PIHL is not?? Seems like an odd conclusion for them to come to.

Go figure.......

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55 minutes ago, fafa fohi said:

I have heard the same.  One parent I spoke to whose son was cut by PPE said in not so many words that PAHL AA was beneath them and their son would only play for his school.  Pretty pompous if you ask me.  

Hell, the Black team is equivalent to PAHL AA.

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, HereWithPopcorn said:

Hell, the Black team is equivalent to PAHL AA.

Don't tell that to the parents paying ten grand or more for AA type hockey with a cool PPE sticker on their vehicle with sweet warmups and gear bags.  It was only this past season when some PAHL teams were beating PPE Black teams.

Edited by fafa fohi

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8 minutes ago, fafa fohi said:

Don't tell that to the parents paying ten grand or more for AA type hockey with a cool PPE sticker on their vehicle with sweet warmups and gear bags.  It was only this past season when some PAHL teams were beating PPE Black teams.

Do you see it happening even more often this year given some of the exodus to PAHL teams (SCIR, Preds, NP)?  Or will they not even bother to play against PAHL?

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1 hour ago, fafa fohi said:

Go figure.......

Ya..... usually the AA teams have more talent across the board than a PIHL team who is limited to their school district. The one  former Pen parent that I spoke to, they sounded burned out and disappointed, too. Maybe school hockey won't be enough and they'll return next year. Or their kid reached the age where he is done.

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Saucey, I don't disagreee with you but the PIHL teams are pretty good at the Varsity level.  Do you compare them to U18 teams?  PIHL vs. PAHL battle of the champions would be something to see.  I may even pay $$ to watch this at the UPMC Center.

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Posted (edited)
On 6/20/2019 at 4:00 PM, HSFBLJ said:

Saucey, I don't disagreee with you but the PIHL teams are pretty good at the Varsity level.  Do you compare them to U18 teams?  PIHL vs. PAHL battle of the champions would be something to see.  I may even pay $$ to watch this at the UPMC Center.

Top pihl varsity team’s  would beat Pahl U18 AA team’s. 

 

Pihl is good hockey accept the A conference. 

 

Just look to Pine Richland from last season. The team they beat for states was loaded with kids playing AAA for the junior flyers, virtue hockey etc. top 30 AAA programs. 

 

most of the top pihl teams have kids that played AAA and realized the end of the road is near. 

Edited by whome87

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Posted (edited)
43 minutes ago, whome87 said:

Top pihl varsity team’s  would beat Pahl U18 AA team’s. 

Pihl is good hockey accept the A conference. 

just look to Pine Richland from last season. The team they beat for states was loaded with kids playing AAA for the junior flyers, virtue hockey etc. top 30 AAA programs. 

I disagree with that assessment.  This isn't even one example as it was school vs. school.  

If you have an 18uAA team with a lot of depth, I think it can handle itself against a good school team.  My experience in watching school teams is that you have a good core (maybe 5-7 kids) and the rest are probably below AA level players.  Most of the school districts that I live near are that way.  On the other hand if you have an AA club team with a lot of depth, the difference will easily be in the 3rd and 4th lines and the D men 5-8...  And most importantly goaltending is super important and if your school doesn't have a stud to lead them good luck.

So I will take the money and go with a GOOD club team versus any school team.  I didn't say a bottom level AA team, I said a GOOD AA team.  I just don't see most school teams being able to go a full game against teams with 4 lines unless they have a GREAT goalie.

One sort of indicator will be in a few weeks as the NPitt 18uAA 1 team is rumored to be mostly all NA varsity and they will be playing their placements in the next 2 weeks against good deep teams (AHA and Preds).  

Edited by Scooby Doo

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54 minutes ago, Scooby Doo said:

I disagree with that assessment.  This isn't even one example as it was school vs. school.  

If you have an 18uAA team with a lot of depth, I think it can handle itself against a good school team.  My experience in watching school teams is that you have a good core (maybe 5-7 kids) and the rest are probably below AA level players.  Most of the school districts that I live near are that way.  On the other hand if you have an AA club team with a lot of depth, the difference will easily be in the 3rd and 4th lines and the D men 5-8...  And most importantly goaltending is super important and if your school doesn't have a stud to lead them good luck.

So I will take the money and go with a GOOD club team versus any school team.  I didn't say a bottom level AA team, I said a GOOD AA team.  I just don't see most school teams being able to go a full game against teams with 4 lines unless they have a GREAT goalie.

One sort of indicator will be in a few weeks as the NPitt 18uAA 1 team is rumored to be mostly all NA varsity and they will be playing their placements in the next 2 weeks against good deep teams (AHA and Preds).  

Just like most AAA teams. Most good varsity teams play 3 lines and 2 D pair. Last year Pine Richland, NA, Latrobe, etc would have blown the doors off any Pahl U18 AA teams. There really wasn’t any strong Pahl teams at that age.

 

depth wouldn’t matter much, in fact the Pahl team rolling 4 lines would probably hurt them. The better varsity teams play their top players. The 4th line never sees the ice. 

 

I do agree about the goalie stuff. Any team AAA, AA, VARSITY the goalie can be a deciding factor. 

 

You yourself just said it above, np aa 18 is most the na varsity team. That np team is the clear early favorite at U18AA and NA is down in talent over its previous  years. 

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I also would like to add there is no Pahl AA team that would ever come close to hanging with downington or some of the other school teams out in philly. They play by different rules that’s why the east wins states 90% of the time. 

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1 hour ago, whome87 said:

Just like most AAA teams. Most good varsity teams play 3 lines and 2 D pair. Last year Pine Richland, NA, Latrobe, etc would have blown the doors off any Pahl U18 AA teams. There really wasn’t any strong Pahl teams at that age.

 

depth wouldn’t matter much, in fact the Pahl team rolling 4 lines would probably hurt them. The better varsity teams play their top players. The 4th line never sees the ice. 

Disagree with your assessment on last years PIHL teams and no strong 18AA teams in PAHL last year. Are you forgetting about Armstrong, Predators and Arctic Foxes?

to put numbers to your argument...

PIHL

NA (AAA) ranked #1 in WPA 90.92 rating

Pine (AA) ranked #1 in WPA 92.7 rating

Latrobe (AA) ranked #2 in WPA 91.18 rating

PAHL 18AA

Armstrong ranked #10 with 93.75 rating (don’t see doors getting beat by any PIHL team)

Predators ranked #18 with 93.11 rating (doors get blown off? Nope.)

Arctic Foxes ranked #25 with 92.64 rating (doors are firmly on still)

if you didn’t have a dog in the fight and we’re able to watch these teams play without bias you’d realize you are way overstating PIHL (at least in W.PA...)

 

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2 hours ago, TheUnknown said:

 

if you didn’t have a dog in the fight and we’re able to watch these teams play without bias you’d realize you are way overstating PIHL (at least in W.PA...)

 

I fully agree with your assessment.

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14 hours ago, TheUnknown said:

Disagree with your assessment on last years PIHL teams and no strong 18AA teams in PAHL last year. Are you forgetting about Armstrong, Predators and Arctic Foxes?

to put numbers to your argument...

PIHL

NA (AAA) ranked #1 in WPA 90.92 rating

Pine (AA) ranked #1 in WPA 92.7 rating

Latrobe (AA) ranked #2 in WPA 91.18 rating

PAHL 18AA

Armstrong ranked #10 with 93.75 rating (don’t see doors getting beat by any PIHL team)

Predators ranked #18 with 93.11 rating (doors get blown off? Nope.)

Arctic Foxes ranked #25 with 92.64 rating (doors are firmly on still)

if you didn’t have a dog in the fight and we’re able to watch these teams play without bias you’d realize you are way overstating PIHL (at least in W.PA...)

 

You really can’t cross the hockey rankings between pihl and Pahl. That would be like trying to compare tier 3 juniors vs AAA. Doesn’t line up well.

 

there are a lot of weak teams in pihl, I agreed with that but none of those teams you mentioned would have beat pr, na or Latrobe. Again, depth would hurt more then help the Pahl team. 

 

As as I stated above about 50% of the kids on the 3 pihl teams I listed above were playing good AAA or came from AAA and just played school senior season. 

 

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