Credit where credit is due

[carroll81]

4 hours ago, Duck Bill said:

I think all of their costs are in their "Overview" document here:

https://www.pittsburghpenguinselite.com/documents

Thank you Bill.  Totally missed that when looking at that pages.

Just doing a really quick comparison to a couple eastern pa teams at 14U, PPE is over $1000 more per person.  Will dig a little deeper when I have the time.

[Carl Racki]

I like how midget 15u-18u just says "contact for pricing" lol. Must be reasonable!

[CranjisMcBasketball]

2 hours ago, Carl Racki said:

I like how midget 15u-18u just says "contact for pricing" lol. Must be reasonable!

If you have to ask…

[Duck Bill]

15 hours ago, Carl Racki said:

I like how midget 15u-18u just says "contact for pricing" lol. Must be reasonable!

I'm pretty sure they literally update that right before tryouts, because there was a number there before.  The lack of transparency there is amazing.

[sadday4hockey]

Market price - whatever today's sucker fish will pay.

[Icebucket]

On 4/7/2025 at 5:40 PM, Carl Racki said:

I like how midget 15u-18u just says "contact for pricing" lol. Must be reasonable!

I'm hearing midget pricing is north of 20k, before you factor in North Catholic.

I'm sure it also depends on who you are though. Top dogs aren't paying what the majority of the team is 

[NOSHObender]

Pierre McGuire was singing the praises of PPE yesterday on his weekly spot on Mark Madden's radio show....  Cost just went up as a result I'm sure.  

[sadday4hockey]

Unfortunately, the cost to play this great sport precludes far too many from the experience.

[nemesis8679]

On 4/9/2025 at 9:10 AM, sadday4hockey said:

Unfortunately, the cost to play this great sport precludes far too many from the experience.

I know Icemen and Vengeance players that have gone $20,000- $30,000 in with travel included. To get to the level necessary is ungodly expensive. Then the time commitment. Everything centered on the individual to focus and pursue the success. This is why professional race car drivers, golfers, tennis players, fishermen... and yes, hockey players, mostly come from wealthy families. People have seen the money that can be made, so the sports have become focused on the money. School sports (not college) will be dismantled eventually in favor of paid leagues. Sure, they'll have teams. But all the "talent" will be playing for their"elite" teams and they'll frown on their players playing for the free or at least less expensive school team. Basketball is becoming that, baseball is on its way, too. The only sport that doesn't seem to be heading that way is football, yet. Not sure why that is. But they have been doing the private kicker training schools and stuff for a while. 

All sports now are not for fun, socializing, or health. Sports are money.

 

 

 

[sadday4hockey]

40 minutes ago, nemesis8679 said:

The only sport that doesn't seem to be heading that way is football, yet. Not sure why that is. But they have been doing the private kicker training schools and stuff for a while. 

Agree with everything but this.

IMG Academy and the others like it?

 

NIL money to HS players!!

 

They're all in it for the cold hard cash.

[nemesis8679]

2 hours ago, sadday4hockey said:

Agree with everything but this.

IMG Academy and the others like it?

 

NIL money to HS players!!

 

They're all in it for the cold hard cash.

I don't know what NIL means. I don't follow football much beyond some kids I know that play. I didn't know it privatization was prevalent with football, too. But not surprised to hear it.

 

[sadday4hockey]

Name, Image, Likeness

The thing that is ruining all amateur athletics, money and greed.

 

[Carl Racki]

4 hours ago, nemesis8679 said:

I know Icemen and Vengeance players that have gone $20,000- $30,000 in with travel included. To get to the level necessary is ungodly expensive. Then the time commitment. Everything centered on the individual to focus and pursue the success. This is why professional race car drivers, golfers, tennis players, fishermen... and yes, hockey players, mostly come from wealthy families. People have seen the money that can be made, so the sports have become focused on the money. School sports (not college) will be dismantled eventually in favor of paid leagues. Sure, they'll have teams. But all the "talent" will be playing for their"elite" teams and they'll frown on their players playing for the free or at least less expensive school team. Basketball is becoming that, baseball is on its way, too. The only sport that doesn't seem to be heading that way is football, yet. Not sure why that is. But they have been doing the private kicker training schools and stuff for a while. 

All sports now are not for fun, socializing, or health. Sports are money.

 

 

 

I hope you are misinformed and no one ever payed $20,000 or more to play Icemen even all in lol

[nemesis8679]

2 hours ago, Carl Racki said:

I hope you are misinformed and no one ever payed $20,000 or more to play Icemen even all in lol

Was told about $23,000 all-in. True? 🤷‍♂️ Buts that's what I was told. Maybe it included some lessons during the season, too. I don't know.

Edited April 15, 2025 by nemesis8679

[aaaahockey]

36 minutes ago, nemesis8679 said:

Was told about $23,000 all-in. True? 🤷‍♂️ Buts that's what I was told. Maybe it included some lessons during the season, too. I don't know.

What age group?

[hockeyisgreat]

When you start adding Hotel rooms, Plane Tickets, rental cars, gas, and food, it adds up quick for sure!

If PAHL was a better product I think more kids would be willing to stay and play!  They do nothing for player recognition,  AHF keeps stats and all star teams for a little recognition for the kids at a minimal cost!  When is the PAHL going to Gamesheet or even using the software they have correctly?  PIHL can do it!  Why can't the PAHL?

[kid310050]

1 hour ago, hockeyisgreat said:

When you start adding Hotel rooms, Plane Tickets, rental cars, gas, and food, it adds up quick for sure!

If PAHL was a better product I think more kids would be willing to stay and play!  They do nothing for player recognition,  AHF keeps stats and all star teams for a little recognition for the kids at a minimal cost!  When is the PAHL going to Gamesheet or even using the software they have correctly?  PIHL can do it!  Why can't the PAHL?

PAHL goes out of their way to hide player stats and if they do go to Gamesheet I'm sure they will do the same. Their refusal to adapt is just going to lead to more and more teams playing for the AFH.

[aaaahockey]

4 minutes ago, kid310050 said:

PAHL goes out of their way to hide player stats and if they do go to Gamesheet I'm sure they will do the same. Their refusal to adapt is just going to lead to more and more teams playing for the AFH.

I don't think this is true. No one wants to drive to New Jersey for a PAHL equivalent league.

[YardSale]

1 minute ago, aaaahockey said:

I don't think this is true. No one wants to drive to New Jersey for a PAHL equivalent league.

I know we actively avoid blackbear rinks when looking at tryouts for that reason.

[hockeyisgreat]

15 minutes ago, YardSale said:

I know we actively avoid blackbear rinks when looking at tryouts for that reason.

So you are happy with the way PAHL runs the local league? It seems to me that Blackbear rinks have PAHL teams!  When the AHF has enough teams in Western Pa and Eastern Ohio to form a league PAHL will only have itself to blame!  I think it is coming sooner than you think!

[YardSale]

1 minute ago, hockeyisgreat said:

So you are happy with the way PAHL runs the local league? It seems to me that Blackbear rinks have PAHL teams!  When the AHF has enough teams in Western Pa and Eastern Ohio to form a league PAHL will only have itself to blame!  I think it is coming sooner than you think!

I think PAHL has improvements to make, but I'm not driving to Philly to play PAHL level of competition.  I'd rather have our own independent games and choose our own tournaments.

[hockeyisgreat]

3 minutes ago, YardSale said:

I think PAHL has improvements to make, but I'm not driving to Philly to play PAHL level of competition.  I'd rather have our own independent games and choose our own tournaments.

So where are you willing to drive to for competition on your level?  Is reasonable travel within 4 hours? What I think you will see in the future is a Western Pa, Eastern Ohio Blackbear (AHF) run league that is way better than PAHL.  PAHL will be half the size it is now!  Might be good for them to try to get their league up to par!

[YardSale]

5 minutes ago, hockeyisgreat said:

So where are you willing to drive to for competition on your level?  Is reasonable travel within 4 hours? What I think you will see in the future is a Western Pa, Eastern Ohio Blackbear (AHF) run league that is way better than PAHL.  PAHL will be half the size it is now!  Might be good for them to try to get their league up to par!

Detroit, Ohio, Buffalo.  being able to select the teams we play rather than having dictated showcases.  I agree they have work to do.  I just don't think blackbear is the answer.

[hockeyisgreat]

28 minutes ago, YardSale said:

Detroit, Ohio, Buffalo.  being able to select the teams we play rather than having dictated showcases.  I agree they have work to do.  I just don't think blackbear is the answer.

I'm not advocating for Blackbear. I just think PAHL's incompetence and unwillingness to change is opening the door!

[aaaahockey]

1 hour ago, hockeyisgreat said:

So where are you willing to drive to for competition on your level?  Is reasonable travel within 4 hours? What I think you will see in the future is a Western Pa, Eastern Ohio Blackbear (AHF) run league that is way better than PAHL.  PAHL will be half the size it is now!  Might be good for them to try to get their league up to par!

For in-league games?  Maybe 2 hours max.   And that should be like 1 or 2 teams on the fringe of civilization (Johnstown, Lawrence county, etc).  Normally? 20-30 minutes for an away game  

Edited April 15, 2025 by aaaahockey