August 1, 2025Aug 1 Looks like PIHL posted the divisions for next season. Fox Chapel up to AAA Bethel Park down to AA Shaler and Wheeling Park up to AA Canon Mac down to A Thoughts?
August 1, 2025Aug 1 So I have a question about the D2 Division that maybe someone can answer. Are these schools in this division strictly co-op and are there numbers based on enrollment like what you would see in the WPIAL with football?
August 1, 2025Aug 1 39 minutes ago, newhockeydad said: So I have a question about the D2 Division that maybe someone can answer. Are these schools in this division strictly co-op and are there numbers based on enrollment like what you would see in the WPIAL with football? Yes AAA - AA - A are based on enrollment + Competitve formula Edited August 1, 2025Aug 1 by Pa Hockey
August 1, 2025Aug 1 56 minutes ago, Icebucket said: Looks like PIHL posted the divisions for next season. Fox Chapel up to AAA Bethel Park down to AA Shaler and Wheeling Park up to AA Canon Mac down to A Thoughts? Bethel Park has been in AAA for 50 + Years Wheeling is ineligible for PC and there are better programs with JVs to compete Wasnt Fox Chapel in A 3 years ago ? Canon Mac has 16 of 17 players returning + JV and made the playoffs ?
August 2, 2025Aug 2 Are they still using the same formula? It doesn't appear they published the numbers for last year on the website yet. Really, The formula is flawed because it looks back too far. Kids are graduating college and their high school results are still being used to place their former high school team! Wheeling Park couldn't even win a game a few years ago, they had a decent win percentage the last two years beating a lot of bad teams. But like 3 horrendous seasons and two average seasons. Their moving up is because they have a huge enrollment, but 95% of their district never even heard of hockey, so that doesn't really help them competitively. Sorry but they aren't a AA hockey school. And what's that gonna mean, there will be 10 teams in AA, 1 is ineligible for playoff, so 8 of the 9 teams make the playoffs?!?! Someone will get into the playoffs with like 3 wins? How about a team like Mars that had a long history of success, then had a couple down years with goalie problems, and have been a top team again in A the last couple years? Enrollment bigger than most of A or AA. That's a team with size, hockey traditions and resources that should be AA. Canan Mac should be embarrassed to compete in A. Moving down from AAA to A in a couple years. A huge school with a hockey tradition, pens cup wins. They weren't bad at AA last year, competitive in most games. Let them put on their big boy pants and build a program back up. Baldwin has had more lopsided losses the last couple of years than CM. What really should happen is about 6 teams move up from A to AA. A is way too big, too wide of a talent gap, the bottom of A are basically JV teams, too many meaningless games.
August 2, 2025Aug 2 1 hour ago, zam said: Are they still using the same formula? It doesn't appear they published the numbers for last year on the website yet. Really, The formula is flawed because it looks back too far. Kids are graduating college and their high school results are still being used to place their former high school team! Wheeling Park couldn't even win a game a few years ago, they had a decent win percentage the last two years beating a lot of bad teams. But like 3 horrendous seasons and two average seasons. Their moving up is because they have a huge enrollment, but 95% of their district never even heard of hockey, so that doesn't really help them competitively. Sorry but they aren't a AA hockey school. And what's that gonna mean, there will be 10 teams in AA, 1 is ineligible for playoff, so 8 of the 9 teams make the playoffs?!?! Someone will get into the playoffs with like 3 wins? How about a team like Mars that had a long history of success, then had a couple down years with goalie problems, and have been a top team again in A the last couple years? Enrollment bigger than most of A or AA. That's a team with size, hockey traditions and resources that should be AA. Canan Mac should be embarrassed to compete in A. Moving down from AAA to A in a couple years. A huge school with a hockey tradition, pens cup wins. They weren't bad at AA last year, competitive in most games. Let them put on their big boy pants and build a program back up. Baldwin has had more lopsided losses the last couple of years than CM. What really should happen is about 6 teams move up from A to AA. A is way too big, too wide of a talent gap, the bottom of A are basically JV teams, too many meaningless games. Your last comment is 100% spot on. Teams such as QV, Mars, NC and Shaler have been consistently good at the A level and are more than capable of competing at the AA level. Yes, there are far too many teams in A and there is a huge disparity between the good and bad teams.
August 2, 2025Aug 2 Author 9 hours ago, zam said: Are they still using the same formula? It doesn't appear they published the numbers for last year on the website yet. Really, The formula is flawed because it looks back too far. Kids are graduating college and their high school results are still being used to place their former high school team! Wheeling Park couldn't even win a game a few years ago, they had a decent win percentage the last two years beating a lot of bad teams. But like 3 horrendous seasons and two average seasons. Their moving up is because they have a huge enrollment, but 95% of their district never even heard of hockey, so that doesn't really help them competitively. Sorry but they aren't a AA hockey school. And what's that gonna mean, there will be 10 teams in AA, 1 is ineligible for playoff, so 8 of the 9 teams make the playoffs?!?! Someone will get into the playoffs with like 3 wins? How about a team like Mars that had a long history of success, then had a couple down years with goalie problems, and have been a top team again in A the last couple years? Enrollment bigger than most of A or AA. That's a team with size, hockey traditions and resources that should be AA. Canan Mac should be embarrassed to compete in A. Moving down from AAA to A in a couple years. A huge school with a hockey tradition, pens cup wins. They weren't bad at AA last year, competitive in most games. Let them put on their big boy pants and build a program back up. Baldwin has had more lopsided losses the last couple of years than CM. What really should happen is about 6 teams move up from A to AA. A is way too big, too wide of a talent gap, the bottom of A are basically JV teams, too many meaningless games. I think you are pretty much spot on. Although I do think Wheeling Park will do better than a handful of AA teams. Not that it matters though as they can't play in the playoffs
August 3, 2025Aug 3 On 8/2/2025 at 8:49 AM, zam said: Are they still using the same formula? It doesn't appear they published the numbers for last year on the website yet. Really, The formula is flawed because it looks back too far. Kids are graduating college and their high school results are still being used to place their former high school team! Wheeling Park couldn't even win a game a few years ago, they had a decent win percentage the last two years beating a lot of bad teams. But like 3 horrendous seasons and two average seasons. Their moving up is because they have a huge enrollment, but 95% of their district never even heard of hockey, so that doesn't really help them competitively. Sorry but they aren't a AA hockey school. And what's that gonna mean, there will be 10 teams in AA, 1 is ineligible for playoff, so 8 of the 9 teams make the playoffs?!?! Someone will get into the playoffs with like 3 wins? How about a team like Mars that had a long history of success, then had a couple down years with goalie problems, and have been a top team again in A the last couple years? Enrollment bigger than most of A or AA. That's a team with size, hockey traditions and resources that should be AA. Canan Mac should be embarrassed to compete in A. Moving down from AAA to A in a couple years. A huge school with a hockey tradition, pens cup wins. They weren't bad at AA last year, competitive in most games. Let them put on their big boy pants and build a program back up. Baldwin has had more lopsided losses the last couple of years than CM. What really should happen is about 6 teams move up from A to AA. A is way too big, too wide of a talent gap, the bottom of A are basically JV teams, too many meaningless games. Outstanding post The PIHL needs a Matrix using current player enrollment and rank schools Tier 1 AAA Tier 2 AA and Tier 3 A based on numbers (A and JV) Mars CM and others with JV should be in AA
August 6, 2025Aug 6 They don't know what they are doing. PIHL is a joke. The board does not bring anything new to the league to make it competitive.
August 6, 2025Aug 6 Gonna be a bumpy ride. They chased away their best (by far) member a few months ago. No mo' money from Pens Foundation for the league website so now associations are left scrambling for a new means of team communication. The "Commissioner" resembles something we witnessed recently in that he's just a confused puppet meandering aimlessly about his day, a figure-head at best and probably a waste of a lot of money.
August 7, 2025Aug 7 On 8/1/2025 at 4:02 PM, Pa Hockey said: Bethel Park has been in AAA for 50 + Years Wheeling is ineligible for PC and there are better programs with JVs to compete Wasnt Fox Chapel in A 3 years ago ? Canon Mac has 16 of 17 players returning + JV and made the playoffs ? I'll add that in A, Charters Valley hasn't lost a game (maybe one?) in the last two seasons. Yet they remain in A. If they took the top 4 or 5 teams in each A division and put them together and the bottom teams together, they'd have two competitive divisions. You don't need a "formula" for this, it can be seen with peoples' eyes. Yet their big move is to move Shaler and Wheeling Park. OK. So the lower teams will continue to be pummeled week after week. Great way to help schools build their hockey programs. No wonder some have 10 skaters or less. I feel bad for those kids that want to play. I've said it for years. Instead of some old dinosaurs taking guesses on who should go where, they should do like PAHL and each team play two placement games. There's sometimes exceptions of course, but PAHL's system generally works well. And teams should be evaluated for movement every season, not stuck for four seasons if they are moved.
August 7, 2025Aug 7 Author Looking at the two divisions of A, it seems like each has 2 or 3 teams that will dominate the division. Maybe another team or two in each that might give them a test, but the rest will probably get blown out against the big 2/3. Gold will be run by Avonworth, Mars, and maybe CV. Blue will be run by Canon Mac, QV, and maybe Moon. And I could see NC being a possible player as well. Just the way I see it. Edited August 7, 2025Aug 7 by Icebucket
August 8, 2025Aug 8 4 hours ago, Icebucket said: Looking at the two divisions of A, it seems like each has 2 or 3 teams that will dominate the division. Maybe another team or two in each that might give them a test, but the rest will probably get blown out against the big 2/3. Gold will be run by Avonworth, Mars, and maybe CV. Blue will be run by Canon Mac, QV, and maybe Moon. And I could see NC being a possible player as well. Just the way I see it. That's how it's been the past two seasons. 3 or 4 completive teams in each division of A. 3 or 4 that get pummeled, and the middle teams that get wins on those bottom teams and squeek a few from the other mid teams. Yet they continue to structure it this way.
August 8, 2025Aug 8 On 8/1/2025 at 3:24 PM, newhockeydad said: So I have a question about the D2 Division that maybe someone can answer. Are these schools in this division strictly co-op and are there numbers based on enrollment like what you would see in the WPIAL with football? Co-op teams
August 8, 2025Aug 8 6 hours ago, CranjisMcBasketball said: Co-op teams I would add that once you have to go in co-op, it's very hard to move out of that.
August 10, 2025Aug 10 Division alignment isn't that hard. If we know Canon-Mac doesn't belong in A so do the coaches. Sit down and let the coaches hack it out. Prevents sandbagging as well.
August 11, 2025Aug 11 On 8/6/2025 at 2:52 PM, sadday4hockey said: Gonna be a bumpy ride. They chased away their best (by far) member a few months ago. No mo' money from Pens Foundation for the league website so now associations are left scrambling for a new means of team communication. The "Commissioner" resembles something we witnessed recently in that he's just a confused puppet meandering aimlessly about his day, a figure-head at best and probably a waste of a lot of money. Who is the "best member"?
August 11, 2025Aug 11 12 hours ago, Spear and Magic Helmet said: Who is the "best member"? Agreed Sad Day ........................the PIHL lost a VIP and should reconcile fast Edited August 12, 2025Aug 12 by Pa Hockey
August 12, 2025Aug 12 On 8/10/2025 at 5:20 PM, Denis Lemiuex said: Division alignment isn't that hard. If we know Canon-Mac doesn't belong in A so do the coaches. Sit down and let the coaches hack it out. Prevents sandbagging as well. Sandbagging How? During the previous season? They have no placement games for consideration.
August 12, 2025Aug 12 On 8/10/2025 at 5:20 PM, Denis Lemiuex said: Division alignment isn't that hard. If we know Canon-Mac doesn't belong in A so do the coaches. Sit down and let the coaches hack it out. Prevents sandbagging as well. Conduct a preseason Coaches poll, Coaches submit their roster, and then every coach in the league reviews the rosters and submits a ranking of how they see the rest of the teams finishing. If there are clearcut 1,2 teams, move them up a division, also if there is a team or two that is bottom on everybody's list, then move them down a division. I am not sure how you would keep teams from "hiding" strong players and adding them after the alignment decisions, but hopefully that wouldn't happen. And I think most coaches and players are wise to the other players in opposing teams districts and if they suspected those players were going to play they would factor that into their ratings. I don't think any coaches "sandbag" a season for the sake of potentially dropping a division next year, (it would probably take 2/3 years of losing based on the formula).. These boards don't even keep coaches in this league when they win, so i think sandbagging a season cant be great for job security!
August 12, 2025Aug 12 6 hours ago, zam said: I am not sure how you would keep teams from "hiding" strong players and adding them after the alignment decisions, but hopefully that wouldn't happen. Easy. Set a date prior to setting divisions that you can't add any more players to the roster. On the fence with playing or not? Make up your mind. Waiting until after football season to play? Too bad. Get on the roster beforehand. If you're missing games and practices, that the player's choice. Player didn't find out they needed to register until after the deadline? School should've done a better job communicating or the player and their family should've been more proactive to reach out to the team. We all know around when things start up. You have all summer to get registered. For every excuse PIHL uses to justify ranking teams like a bunch of pea brains, there's easy ways to fix it.
August 12, 2025Aug 12 A pre-season coaches poll might not be very effective if you’re asking teams in Erie about their projected skill and roster of say a team in Wheeling or Johnstown etc. Not sure how familiar one would be with the other
August 12, 2025Aug 12 There are also some top players that aren't playing PIHL this year. Some teams have some huge unexpected holes to fill.
August 12, 2025Aug 12 1 hour ago, nemesis8679 said: Easy. Set a date prior to setting divisions that you can't add any more players to the roster. On the fence with playing or not? Make up your mind. Waiting until after football season to play? Too bad. Get on the roster beforehand. If you're missing games and practices, that the player's choice. Player didn't find out they needed to register until after the deadline? School should've done a better job communicating or the player and their family should've been more proactive to reach out to the team. We all know around when things start up. You have all summer to get registered. For every excuse PIHL uses to justify ranking teams like a bunch of pea brains, there's easy ways to fix it. I think this is asking for lawyers to get involved... So a player moves into a district on September 1 due to a parent's job transfer, that player cannot play PIHL hockey because a "roster freeze" went into effect on say August 1st even though the regular season won't start for over a month? Edited August 12, 2025Aug 12 by Corsi
August 12, 2025Aug 12 12 minutes ago, twoboys said: There are also some top players that aren't playing PIHL this year. Some teams have some huge unexpected holes to fill. Assuming you mean players on teams that are expected to perform really well?
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