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34 minutes ago, nemesis8679 said:

While not ideal, I have to say that "killing one of these kids" because of wearing a mask is a bit hyperbolic. Teams have been doing it for months already. 

Yes. It's very dramatic to say such a thing. I have done hard sweaty work in an N95 mask and it sucks but it's tolerable. The blue surgical masks are much less restrictive. I see that some schools are shutting down their sports now as they move to remote learning. Hockey is still alive for now. I wonder how much longer as just about every county is now in the substantial spread category.

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8 hours ago, Danner27 said:

It’s not a rink thing, all players are to wear masks while on the ice. Ludicrous! They are going to kill one of these kids! Just shut it all down at this point, restart in January. 

The government will just say that if you can't play in masks, hockey should not be happening.

But, with all due respect to @Danner27, with whom I do not have a beef, this is just wrong. Players can, and have been, play in masks. My daughter's team practiced in full masks last night, and they skated quite a few Herbies in order to get ready for wearing them in games. I don't like it - and the players will hate it even more than I will hate enforcing it - but it can be done, and if my beer league started requiring them, I'd wear them and keep playing, if the alternative is not playing at all.

As for spectators, it's clear from the order that they're concerned about indoor air quality as a vector in transmission. Agree with this or not, I expect spectators to be banned at hockey games pretty soon.

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1 hour ago, Lifelongbender said:

It's correct that this is not a rink thing, but a regional thing, but for the sake of completeness YMCA has issued the same requirement for masks on the ice.

It is required by PAHL now. We already got an email from our organization. The kids have to wear them in all PAHL games this weekend. 

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It’s not a rink thing, regional thing, league thing... it’s a STATE ORDER. That means everyone will have to comply or sports are very likely to be shutdown. 

https://www.health.pa.gov/topics/disease/coronavirus/Pages/Guidance/Universal-Masking-FAQ.aspx

Does the Order apply to athletes and sports activities?
Yes. Everyone who participates in sport activities including coaches, athletes (including cheerleaders), and spectators must wear a face covering, such as a mask, unless they fall under an exception in Section 3 of the Order. 

Indoors: Coaches, athletes (including cheerleaders), and spectators must wear face coverings, when indoors and where another person or persons who are not members of the individual's household are present in the same space, irrespective of physical distance. This includes while actively engaged in workouts, competition, and on the sidelines, etc. 

Outdoors: Coaches, athletes (including cheerleaders), and spectators must wear face coverings if they cannot maintain sustained physical distance from persons outside of their household. This includes while actively engaged in workouts, competition, and on the sidelines, in the dugout, etc. If sustained six-foot distancing can be maintained, face coverings may be removed when outdoors.

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6 minutes ago, TheRightCall said:

Okay, from an officiating perspective, this is horrible for us. 

*electronic whistles = absurd

*mask = arbitrarily absurd

*communicating with coaches, scorekeeper, players for offside, easy on the boards, etc. = absolutely absurd

This is "horrible" for all of us!  I don't totally understand the dramatic increase in cases!  I personally think it had a lot to do with the election.  People celebrating and protesting the election. I'm ready for the vaccine.  I will be at the front of the line "hopefully" to get it done.  So far the health system in Western Pa is not getting overwhelmed and the kids I know who have or had it only had mild symptoms.  Less severe than the flu. They feel relived that they had it and are over it.  I have watched a lot of games on Live Barn this fall and will continue.  Unfortunately crowds are making me nervous and some of those ADM games are packed.  6 teams playing cross ice have a lot of people in the stands.

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1 minute ago, hockeyisgreat said:

Unfortunately crowds are making me nervous and some of those ADM games are packed.  6 teams playing cross ice have a lot of people in the stands.

ADM games can only have 2 games at once this season. 4 teams total and only parent per player. Around 80 total people on the ice and in the stands. 

I gave my kid the choice of wearing a mask while playing or not play at all. He chose the mask.

Everything will be shut down again soon anyway. Just trying to get ice time while we still can.

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14 minutes ago, hockeyisgreat said:

This is "horrible" for all of us!  I don't totally understand the dramatic increase in cases!  I personally think it had a lot to do with the election.  People celebrating and protesting the election. I'm ready for the vaccine.  I will be at the front of the line "hopefully" to get it done.  So far the health system in Western Pa is not getting overwhelmed and the kids I know who have or had it only had mild symptoms.  Less severe than the flu. They feel relived that they had it and are over it.  I have watched a lot of games on Live Barn this fall and will continue.  Unfortunately crowds are making me nervous and some of those ADM games are packed.  6 teams playing cross ice have a lot of people in the stands.

I was simply trying to give a perspective in terms of game management and such.

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3 minutes ago, forbin said:

ADM games can only have 2 games at once this season. 4 teams total and only parent per player. Around 80 total people on the ice and in the stands. 

I gave my kid the choice of wearing a mask while playing or not play at all. He chose the mask.

Everything will be shut down again soon anyway. Just trying to get ice time while we still can.

Where I was sure didn't follow those rules!  What did make me nervous most was the people in the stands that didn't have masks. That's when I decided to try to watch games on Live Barn.  I'm sure most young players will wear a mask as opposed to not playing. I'm sure there are a lot of people like me that are wearing the masks with minimal protection.  What I mean is I touch mine way to much and it always falls down also fogs my glasses. I don't feel like I am protecting myself or anyone else. I definitely have Covid Fatigue.

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3 minutes ago, hockeyisgreat said:

This is "horrible" for all of us!  I don't totally understand the dramatic increase in cases!  I personally think it had a lot to do with the election.  People celebrating and protesting the election. I'm ready for the vaccine.  I will be at the front of the line "hopefully" to get it done.  So far the health system in Western Pa is not getting overwhelmed and the kids I know who have or had it only had mild symptoms.  Less severe than the flu. They feel relived that they had it and are over it.  I have watched a lot of games on Live Barn this fall and will continue.  Unfortunately crowds are making me nervous and some of those ADM games are packed.  6 teams playing cross ice have a lot of people in the stands.

I think we can thank some Halloween parties for this as well. Yes, those mass gatherings you mentioned didn't do us any favors either, Rallies, protests & celebrations all reflect the selfish side of humanity. Even the health officials say that structured events seem to be the least of our problems. I'm not totally comfortable with any kids getting it. They not only spread it but it is not known how the body reacts in the long term. But yes... Thank God it appears to be a mild illness for kids. I am fairly comfortable with the safety of the on-ice participation, but the benches and locker rooms seem like a place where masks should be worn. No way to safely put on/remove masks between shifts so this seems to make sense since the community spread is so high now.

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2 minutes ago, TheRightCall said:

I was simply trying to give a perspective in terms of game management and such.

Believe me I understand.  I think the Refs are the bravest of all as we couldn't play without you guys. Now you will be hampered even further.  I wonder if this means the Steelers and opponents will have to wear masks?

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Just now, hockeyisgreat said:

Believe me I understand.  I think the Refs are the bravest of all as we couldn't play without you guys. Now you will be hampered even further.  I wonder if this means the Steelers and opponents will have to wear masks?

Very good point--why should the professionals be exempt?

Stay safe! 

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2 hours ago, Ynot02 said:

It’s not a rink thing, regional thing, league thing... it’s a STATE ORDER. That means everyone will have to comply or sports are very likely to be shutdown. 

https://www.health.pa.gov/topics/disease/coronavirus/Pages/Guidance/Universal-Masking-FAQ.aspx

Does the Order apply to athletes and sports activities?
Yes. Everyone who participates in sport activities including coaches, athletes (including cheerleaders), and spectators must wear a face covering, such as a mask, unless they fall under an exception in Section 3 of the Order. 

Indoors: Coaches, athletes (including cheerleaders), and spectators must wear face coverings, when indoors and where another person or persons who are not members of the individual's household are present in the same space, irrespective of physical distance. This includes while actively engaged in workouts, competition, and on the sidelines, etc. 

Outdoors: Coaches, athletes (including cheerleaders), and spectators must wear face coverings if they cannot maintain sustained physical distance from persons outside of their household. This includes while actively engaged in workouts, competition, and on the sidelines, in the dugout, etc. If sustained six-foot distancing can be maintained, face coverings may be removed when outdoors.

But it’s not an “order” or “mandate”. It’s a recommendation. The problem falls with liability towards personal business (ice rinks). The rinks should be making the call in regards to on ice masks, not any league. 

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1 hour ago, Danner27 said:

But it’s not an “order” or “mandate”. It’s a recommendation. The problem falls with liability towards personal business (ice rinks). The rinks should be making the call in regards to on ice masks, not any league. 

I'm sorry, but this is simply incorrect. Like it or not face masking is mandated by the state government. From the header of the recent order:

Quote

UPDATED ORDER OF THE SECRETARY OF THE PENNSYLVANIA DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH REQUIRING UNIVERSAL FACE COVERINGS

From section 2 of the order:

Quote

Section 2: Face Coverings Required

Except as provided in Section 3, every individual, age two and older, in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania shall wear a face covering when:

A. Indoors or in an enclosed space, where another person or persons who are not members of the individual’s household are present in the same space, irrespective of physical distance.

My emphasis on the above quotes. Obviously the list of circumstances continues ad nauseum.

For the record, this question and answer are part of the FAQ that was released yesterday about the mask mandate:

Quote

What happens if I don't wear a mask?

The wearing of a face covering, such as a mask, helps us as a society to limit the spread of COVID-19 and successfully combat this pandemic; therefore, it is in everyone's best interest that all Pennsylvanians comply with this Order.

As this is a legal Order under the Disease Prevention and Control Law, law enforcement officers are authorized to issue warnings or citations to anyone who does not comply with the Order. The Department of Health can also issue warnings and citations to businesses, persons, facilities, and organizations that do not comply.

Again, emphasis mine.

Whatever you may think about the reasonableness or efficacy of masking in controlling this outbreak, it is a fact that our state government has decided that you must wear masks in public places indoors whether or not social distancing can be maintained. There cannot be any doubt that until tested by a Court and then vacated by the Court this order must be considered a legal and binding one. Any claim otherwise is incorrect. For the record I doubt strongly that masking at any time is worthwhile, and I am certain that masking on ice, while possible and not really dangerous as some have claimed, is ridiculous and has no merit. I just wanted to make sure that there aren't people who think that this is somehow not a legally binding order. You, your organization, and the ice rink, can all be cited for violation of this order (although it's not clear to me from this order/FAQ response what the possible consequences for an individual might be from a legal standpoint).

There is an exemption for medical issues in Section 3. It's a safe bet that nobody will wear a mask on the ice, and refer to that when called out for it. Eventually there will be a shutdown because they'll say we aren't complying with "commonsense measures to control the outbreak" or something that means the same thing.

My kids have games on both days of this weekend, but I'd be willing to give at least even odds that we don't even get to play this weekend, much less any weekend afterwards.

Edited by Lifelongbender
clarification
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@hockeyisgreat Where were you? Because all PAHL ADM jams this season only have 4 teams. Look at the website.

I am naively optimistic that we can get through this coming weekend and hopefully thanksgiving tournament weekend. I could see PAHL halting play until after Christmas. Hopefully the rinks can still stay open for practices during that time.

 

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4 minutes ago, forbin said:

@hockeyisgreat Where were you? Because all PAHL ADM jams this season only have 4 teams. Look at the website.

I am naively optimistic that we can get through this coming weekend and hopefully thanksgiving tournament weekend. I could see PAHL halting play until after Christmas. Hopefully the rinks can still stay open for practices during that time.

 

Man I hope you're right. At least this weekend.

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