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An examination of the Viper Stars


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Now remember what these teams were proposed to be and in case you've forgotten, here it is.

NHAHA's Tier II Hockey Program

The Pittsburgh Viper Stars Tier II select hockey program provides a fun, healthy and competitive atmosphere in which players can strive to be their best. As part of the North Hills Amateur Hockey Association, and in conjunction with the program’s Pittsburgh Vipers and Esmark Stars Tier I AAA Hockey program, the Viper Stars will bridge the gap between elite Tier I hockey and house/rec hockey.

The Viper Stars program will offer Tier I level training opportunities currently not provided to most Tier II players and programs. We look to achieve these goals by providing experienced coaching, innovative training and the appropriate practice to game ratio. The focus of the Viper Stars program will be to develop elite athletes that compete at the Tier II level from the regular season to the National Championships

 

Results thus far:

U18 - PAHL A Major - winless and last place

U16 - defunct in August leaving 10-12 players searching for a home with no prior warning

U14 - PAHL AA Major - 2-6-1 with 24 GF and 45 GA

U13 - Independent - 6th out of 6 Ranked Tier 2 2005 teams in Pittsburgh - https://www.myhockeyrankings.com/rank.php?s=PA&y=2018&a=3&v=125

U12 - PAHL AA - last place

U11 - PAHL A Major - 12th place/ 16 teams

So the name changed but the product is basically the same as the Selects.

 

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I just don't get why everyone is so quick to bash other organizations.  There are plenty of parents whose kids love hockey and want to play and practice a lot.  So, they aren't the best kids but the parents would rather have them on the ice more than other programs offer.  Maybe the parents enjoy watching their kids play hockey regardless of whether they win or lose.  More ice is better than playing video games.  The Viper Stars do have some decent coaches.  When you spend time at various rinks you quickly realize that not every coach knows what he is doing.  Let alone have the ability to "coach."   

Every organization has some teams that are lousy.  Some, have more than a few.  At least the kids are still playing hockey. 

The people that I know (parents and kids) that are on the Viper Stars are quite happy. 

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Facts that dispute their website message. That's all. If those facts make them "look bad" that has nothing to do with me posting them. You're upset that these are being posted and yet you imply that you have nothing to do with the organization and that you only know people that play there. If that's truly the case, then why are you the defender of all?

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You're obviously referring only to your son's age group which is the 05's and here is the only part of the question that I can provide facts about. 4 of the teams attended the Harborcenter tournament in September. 3 of the 4 qualified for the semis and the one that did not tied the eventual Tournament Champion in Pool play. So, I would say that yes they have had success in Tournaments. Here is the link to verify the FACTS.

 

https://www.rinksatharborcenter.com/page/show/4493011-13u-aa?_ga=2.74960342.550831545.1544452121-1282676978.1536331085

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2 hours ago, dazedandconfused said:

You're obviously referring only to your son's age group which is the 05's and here is the only part of the question that I can provide facts about. 4 of the teams attended the Harborcenter tournament in September. 3 of the 4 qualified for the semis and the one that did not tied the eventual Tournament Champion in Pool play. So, I would say that yes they have had success in Tournaments. Here is the link to verify the FACTS.

 

https://www.rinksatharborcenter.com/page/show/4493011-13u-aa?_ga=2.74960342.550831545.1544452121-1282676978.1536331085

None of my kids are 05s and they are at another organization. I’m not a fan of Posey-wouldn’t play there. And just asked out of curiosity 

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On 12/7/2018 at 11:29 AM, dazedandconfused said:

So the name changed but the product is basically the same as the Selects.

It might be oversold and buyer beware on anyone's claim to being national bound.  But at least they are playing in PAHL.  Consider it a step in right direction.

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On 12/10/2018 at 9:49 AM, dazedandconfused said:

You're obviously referring only to your son's age group which is the 05's and here is the only part of the question that I can provide facts about. 4 of the teams attended the Harborcenter tournament in September. 3 of the 4 qualified for the semis and the one that did not tied the eventual Tournament Champion in Pool play. So, I would say that yes they have had success in Tournaments. Here is the link to verify the FACTS.

 

https://www.rinksatharborcenter.com/page/show/4493011-13u-aa?_ga=2.74960342.550831545.1544452121-1282676978.1536331085

 

Am I missing something? Clicked on that link and went through every division. I saw a lot of teams from WPA from organizations like Armstrong, the Icemen, SCIR and others but I didn't see a single Viper Stars team listed.

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I guess I don't understand the obsession with standings. First of, there is still a lot more hockey to be played. Second, the standings do not reflect what type of games there were. For instance, were the losses blow outs or 1 goal difference? Third, they may not be high in standings but are learning and developing more. I will be 100% honest and say that my son is on a Viper Stars team. His team has slowly improved with each game and practice. The majority of games that they have played both in PAHL and in tournament have been good competitive games with close scores. He himself has made tremendous progress under his coaches. I myself do not look at standings at all. I pay for my son to develop and get ice time. I pay for him to have experience going to different states and playing different teams outside of the Pittsburgh region. I am quite happy with the instruction he is getting from his head coach and the exposure that he is getting. That alone is worth my money, not the $5 trophy at the end of the season.

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I don't understand everyone's obsession with bashing Posey and any organization he is involved in.  Last year everyone whined about Selects being AAA and not really AAA.  So this year, they merge with Esmark/Vipers and become a AA organization, the Viper Stars.  Now everyone is bitching about that?  My child is not playing there this year which unfortunately, was a financial decision on our behalf.  I will say however that when my son did play for Posey, win or lose he has never loved hockey more.  Brad was a spectacular coach to my son and I will tell you that anyone on that 05 team will tell you the same thing. He is good with the kids, gets them all to give their best each time and continually improve and makes it fun at the same time.  I know he has a past but in my experience with him I have never seen any issue of the rumors that i have heard.  If given the chance, my child would be back with him in a heartbeat.  

The funniest part is a lot of the people I have heard bash him are paying for private lessons with him.  So keep talking, keep sitting on a message board eating sour grapes and running your mouth.  Doesn't seem to be affecting him much.

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8 hours ago, slightlyamused2 said:

I don't understand everyone's obsession with bashing Posey and any organization he is involved in.  Last year everyone whined about Selects being AAA and not really AAA.  So this year, they merge with Esmark/Vipers and become a AA organization, the Viper Stars.  Now everyone is bitching about that?  My child is not playing there this year which unfortunately, was a financial decision on our behalf.  I will say however that when my son did play for Posey, win or lose he has never loved hockey more.  Brad was a spectacular coach to my son and I will tell you that anyone on that 05 team will tell you the same thing. He is good with the kids, gets them all to give their best each time and continually improve and makes it fun at the same time.  I know he has a past but in my experience with him I have never seen any issue of the rumors that i have heard.  If given the chance, my child would be back with him in a heartbeat.  

The funniest part is a lot of the people I have heard bash him are paying for private lessons with him.  So keep talking, keep sitting on a message board eating sour grapes and running your mouth.  Doesn't seem to be affecting him much.

Have you ever had any insight to what happened when he was with the Renegades? 

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It was actually someone from the 03 renegades team who sent me his way. They said he was the best coach their kid ever had.

To that fact, maybe we should look at the way the renegades have continued to decline since and think maybe the organization is an issue? 

My point is that there are many things wrong with hockey now. Look how many organizations are dying off. Why not come up with some suggestions to help or improve things instead of sitting around talking about old rumors and making comments about an organization that is trying to improve on something that wasn't working?

Be part of the solution, not the problem. 

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3 hours ago, slightlyamused2 said:

It was actually someone from the 03 renegades team who sent me his way. They said he was the best coach their kid ever had.

To that fact, maybe we should look at the way the renegades have continued to decline since and think maybe the organization is an issue? 

My point is that there are many things wrong with hockey now. Look how many organizations are dying off. Why not come up with some suggestions to help or improve things instead of sitting around talking about old rumors and making comments about an organization that is trying to improve on something that wasn't working?

Be part of the solution, not the problem. 

as long as you keep your wife away you will be all good 

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On 12/22/2018 at 9:58 PM, slightlyamused2 said:

It was actually someone from the 03 renegades team who sent me his way. They said he was the best coach their kid ever had.

To that fact, maybe we should look at the way the renegades have continued to decline since and think maybe the organization is an issue? 

My point is that there are many things wrong with hockey now. Look how many organizations are dying off. Why not come up with some suggestions to help or improve things instead of sitting around talking about old rumors and making comments about an organization that is trying to improve on something that wasn't working?

Be part of the solution, not the problem. 

It's a good point. Not sure if the problem is stated correctly though. Or if this is the problem that needs to be addressed at all? This could be a vibrant discussion topic that would bring this forum back to life. Lots of opinions here on what the "problems" and "solutions" are...

 

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  • 1 month later...
On 12/7/2018 at 11:29 AM, dazedandconfused said:

Now remember what these teams were proposed to be and in case you've forgotten, here it is.

NHAHA's Tier II Hockey Program

The Pittsburgh Viper Stars Tier II select hockey program provides a fun, healthy and competitive atmosphere in which players can strive to be their best. Check.. As part of the North Hills Amateur Hockey Association, and in conjunction with the program’s Pittsburgh Vipers and Esmark Stars Tier I AAA Hockey program, the Viper Stars will bridge the gap between elite Tier I hockey and house/rec hockey. YEP they did.. 

The Viper Stars program will offer Tier I level training opportunities currently not provided to most Tier II players and programs. They do.. We look to achieve these goals by providing experienced coaching, innovative training and the appropriate practice to game ratio. They did..  The focus of the Viper Stars program will be to develop elite athletes that compete at the Tier II level from the regular season to the National Championships OK, good goal to strive for.. 

 

Results thus far:

U18 - PAHL A Major - winless and last place 

U16 - defunct in August leaving 10-12 players searching for a home with no prior warning this was bad, unfortunate, but could happen anywhere, and there is always a risk of a team disbanding, a risk parents have to weigh when choosing a program.  

U14 - PAHL AA Major - 2-6-1 with 24 GF and 45 GA

U13 - Independent - 6th out of 6 Ranked Tier 2 2005 teams in Pittsburgh - https://www.myhockeyrankings.com/rank.php?s=PA&y=2018&a=3&v=125

U12 - PAHL AA - last place

U11 - PAHL A Major - 12th place/ 16 teams

So the name changed but the product is basically the same as the Selects.

So what exactly are you saying? What you are showing has nothing to do with what their goals and focus are.  Just because they haven't been successful, doesn't mean they aren't striving to meet what they posted..  Just don't get this post.. Are you an upset parent? Did you have a bad experience? Did your kid not improve there? Maybe its your kid, maybe he should be held accountable, but no thats not right always someone else fault.. or are you just a troll? Why do you care about what they are trying to do? I guess if you aren't #1 then your program is shit and fake and false? if thats the case then there are a ton of kids that shouldn't even bother playing.. but then those 1st place teams would have no one to play so yeah.. your points are valid.. in your mind. 

 

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Edited by rock
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