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Maybe people can't afford it, too. The cost of these programs keeps skyrocketing, and they've been around long enough to see you don't get the return promised.

To anybody that thinks a kid moving up from AA to AAA in the later stages of their youth careen can’t be as good as their little Johnny who has always played AAA, go pound salt. I know a kid who didn’t play AAA until U18. Was the best Dman on his AAA team. Went on to NAHL, and then Division 1. His teammates have not have the same success.

But saying, "my kid is such a great hockey player, he's billeting in Ohio to play" sounds so much better at the water cooler.

I wasn't saying AA players aren't capable or deserving of moving up to AAA teams at that age. I was being more critical of the organizations. They treat AAA as a club, you either belong or you don't, it's hard to break in. So they keep bringing in "AAA" kids that peaked when they were 11 years old. Reminds me of NHL coaches, same 30 dudes keep switching teams. How often does a new up and coming coach get a chance?

Look no further than Michael Bunting as a shining example. Never played AAA Midget until his final year of eligibility.

And that is why we have aaa teams that can't fill. The aaa teams think that everyone wants to play aaa. But in reality there are not enough customers willing to pay for extra travel and the same level of hockey you could most likely get local.

The younger you start, the easier it is to get on teams. Once you're on the team, the easier it is to stay. At some point school hockey becomes important to kids. Say what you want, but playing for the school team is important for a lot of kids- it comes with a certain amount of popularity amongst their peers, hearing their name on the announcements, etc. Things that don't come with playing for a Vengeance, Esmark, or wherever. A lot of kids want to go to the movies with their friends or go hang out with their girlfriend or whatever on the weekend. Not say, "oh sorry, I can't go. I have to go to Philadelphia this weekend for hockey" and get left out. So with being on the school team and the commitment that goes with that (and the cost of playing for the school team added in), some kids are going to want to just play for school and a team that's a little bit more schedule-friendly. Believe it or not, some kids like to play hockey but also have other interests and things they like to do. So by this age they start realizing that. And at this age, the parental influence on what they want to do is becoming much less.

@zam hits on an important point, and that's that parents of "tenured" AAA players are not always accepting of new additions if they were historically AA/PAHL players. An established AAA team loses a couple players for whatever reason. As they replace them, other returning families assume there will be a drop-off and then one or two more pull out. At some point there is a run on the bank as more leave what they see as a sinking ship to find a chair somewhere else before the music stops. Its not necessarily that there are not customers, it is sometimes that existing/returning customers, don't accept change.

Props to two local boys making the U18 National Team.

Bingo! Mom and dad finally realize the dream is not attainable and pull back. It’s the same thing every year. We never listen to those ahead of us that tell us exactly how it is. We think they are just bitter and it’s going to be different for us. But in reality it is the same: If at 15u/16u you aren’t a top player on Pens or at a top nationally ranked out of town program, Tier1Juniors/NCAA/pro hockey isn’t in the cards. Yes, there are a few exceptions, but be honest: is your player the exception? From what I’m reading lately, it seems that maybe folks are waking up and bowing out of the AAA rat race and going AA. Maybe we’ll start seeing some better AA and high school hockey in the coming years?

Delusional parents who think the whole world is conspiring against them and that if they get out of Pittsburgh there will be some fresh eyes.

This may be a topic for a different thread, but I never really understood why a parent, whose kid did not make a local U16-18 AAA team would send him away to play AAA in another city or state for his junior year or even worse, his senior year in high school? I mean, are the scouts all of a sudden going to notice this player whether they play for Team Maryland, Tri-State, Nashville Jr Preds or any team in Detroit but were not good enough to make a local AAA team? You would think not making a local AAA team would be a sign not to be ignored? I know of several kids that went through this and ended up being non-drafted players while missing their senior year in HS and taking cyber school. Maybe it's me, I just don't get it.

He has a kid who plays and he coaches. It's not a bad thing to alert the general community regarding what is going on so no organization gives him access to a bank account.

Entertainment purposes only!

Not even that so much about the parents seeing the dream isn't attainable. But where before the parents gotta get Little Johnny to the Vengeance tryouts because those kids are "better" and clearly Little Johnny is better... At 15, 16 years old Little Johnny is now Adolescent Johnny and he's saying, "I want to make extra money, I want to hang out with friends, I like hockey but it's not the only thing I'm interested in that I want to put all this time and effort into when I have a bunch of homework and a part time job and want some video game time, etc." And for the dreamers- I don't think most people realize what that dream really takes. Meaning the work, time, money, and commitment that is in your control nor the "have-it-or-you-don't" genetics and mind for the sport, and luck that is not even in your control.

Yes, sorry I just saw this. We have already posted our roster for the team. If you are still looking send an inquiry to orginfo@ with your hockey history. Thanks,

Not only that, but the players from the River Monsters largely played youth hockey in the area. We talk about college hockey as well.

In this situation, you are probably correct. Esmark was attempting to resurrect something that blew up last year. The consensus has been that parents and players are not going to do the drive to New Kensington. If we look at where the current AAA teams are for 2009, there is PPE (Cranberry), Preds (South Hills), and SHAHA (South Hills). No idea what has/is happening with Vengeance, but Esmark seems to come down to location.

Only argument I have regarding the "no lack of customers" sentiment is that Esmark and Vengeance '09 had really low numbers at their skates and V barely had a turnout at tryouts. That doesn't tell me AA kids are wanting to move up and aren't being taken, that tells me AA kids are happy where they are and see low end AAA for what it is.

There are always going to be "enough customers" and that isn't just for hockey, people will buy into anything. I've said this in prior posts, but the 2009's are now hitting that age where USA Hockey historically sees a drop in registration numbers regardless of the reason (jobs, significant others, booze, etc). Also, it has been stated before that some of these players are needing to decide about PIHL vs. travel hockey and everything else going on in their lives.

Thought preds09 goalie went to south pitt09?

What does it say when an organization has to hold a supplemental tryout to fill open spots for a AAA Tier 1 team? It’s gonna be a long, long season.

Like I said already. We all only paid $350 in total to play for the season. 20 games and full jerseys and equipment I’ll take that any day.