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  1. The "parent coach" discussion always makes me laugh... don't get me wrong there are also parent coaches out there that know very little about the game and just are trying to help, but it's like someone that is good at hockey, knows how to coach, cares about the kids, has considerable hockey knowledge is all of a sudden null and void once they have a kid?! I get it, everyone is worried that kids will be treated "unfairly", "favored", etc. if a parent is behind the bench. If anything, I probably gave/give my kids less leniency when I coached them. I know that isn't always the case, but nothing ever is. So "parent coach", "non-parent coach", who gives a shit. Can the guy/girl coach and treat all the players accordingly? That's all that should matter.
    6 points
  2. My son played in the AHF. I'll say that the league does a much better job of managing their website. Live scoring, stats, players of the week, all-star teams are all pretty cool and certainly add to the experience. I'll also say that the level of competition in that league is absolutely not worth the 10-12 hours of driving you'd do for a weekend, even if you do get 4-6 games. If you're in PAHL already there's no point in adding that amount of driving and hotel stays to play teams that are equal to the competition out here (at best). If you're an independent team you can easily find equal or better competition within 2-3 hours (Ohio, Buffalo) and not take that long trip on the turnpike.
    5 points
  3. If we need more time for the game to be completed before the curfew clock expires, how about allowing players at 16U AA and 18U AA levels to touch up on off sides and also allow them to ice the puck on the PK. Less stoppages of play will allow more time for OT or a shootout. That way we kill two birds with one stone.
    5 points
  4. The reason we have a shortage of officials around the country is due to the post calling out the official by name. I have done games for 20+ years and the behavior of coaches, players, and fans has gotten progressively worse over that time period. Please DO NOT take this as me "calling out" everyone. There are some coaches and players who simply want an explanation and, agree or not, are respectful during the conversation. There are also players, and coaches that decide that they know the game better than everyone involved and thus refuse to have any kind of discussion and simply resort to shouting and swearing until the official has not choice but to impose a penalty for the behavior. That is on the coach and player, not on the official. Unfortunately, this behavior has led to the situation where you have no choice but to take whatever official you can get because no body else will do it. Also, this also isn't exclusive to just hockey, there's a shortage of officials across all sports because of the behavior exhibited by parents, coaches, and players. The simple answer to this is to say "if you think it is so easy, do it yourself", but the earlier post indicates to me that LGP13 probably wouldn't have the temperament to successfully cover a game. There is not a single official in any sport at any level that can say they have never made a mistake on a call or a rule interpretation and that is called being human. I would suggest being appreciative that these men and women are willing to get up at 6AM on a Saturday/Sunday morning so that little Stevie or Sally are able to play their 7AM 10U B game after working their "real job" all week or cover your adult league game at 11PM on a Wednesday night and then get up to go to said job. Always remember, if the officials don't show up, nobody plays.
    5 points
  5. Throw in visiting teams playing at Armstrong’s barn and getting homered by the refs goes into their ranking. The stupid fair play point is in jeopardy for any visiting team before kids lace up the skates. It is an absolute joke. Too bad ballless PAHL stopped posting game stats to indicate penalty minutes for both teams. Seems anabolic hockey parents were up in arms their kid didn’t get credited for an apple in recent games and PAHL caved. Usually the penalty minute ratio at Belmont is 3/1 in favor of the visiting team.
    5 points
  6. That's called equity. If one goes, they all should be invited so as not to make anyone feel inferior.
    4 points
  7. I’m sure Black Bear would be very quick to buy the facility and keep it operational.
    4 points
  8. A coach can ask all kinds of questions, but that doesn't mean that he will always get a response or an explanation. The game needs to be kept moving, so taking time to have a conversation every time a coach has a question or wants an explanation for a call is impossible to have. The majority of questions coaches have are not of the "why did you make that call" sort of thing, they are of the "the other team just did the same thing a period and a half ago and didn't get called, so why are you calling us for it now" type of question. That is a conversation where there's no good outcome for either the coach or the official. No one is going to get an answer that they like in that situation.
    4 points
  9. Lowering the amount officials are being paid would only make the ref shortage worse. I don't think you are going to find people to take time out of their day to do games, especially at the hours many of these games occur. For me to do a 7AM game, I need to be at the rink no later than 6:30 to get ready, and then we add in travel time, I'm probably getting up at 5:30 to do that 7AM game. The amount of money officials make is to give them an incentive to do the games. I would venture to say that by lowering what officials make, would lead to no coverage for games with start times before 9AM and as I stated before... If the officials don't show up, nobody gets to play.
    4 points
  10. There are certainly good parent/coaches out there, some of which I would much rather have coaching my kid than some of these paid coaches with the side training expectation mentioned. Some of these guys are in it for the wrong reasons. Many of the parent/coaches have a great hockey background and are not in it for the money, just the love of the game and wanting to help their kid and his/her teammates with their knowledge.
    4 points
  11. You are definitely new here😂
    4 points
  12. This^^^^ 100%, especially for the dinosaurs within PAHL that are wondering why the league has been on a steady downfall for years, while other similar Tier 2 leagues actually promote their players, have all-star games, post stats and are flourishing. Below is an example of what the CSDHL does for their players.......and what PAHL does for theirs.
    4 points
  13. I disagree to an extent. AAA in our area grew out of a crappy AA (PAHL) alternative (for 80% of player a few years ago). Kids wanting to work hard vs jag off. Kids wanting to pick practice over a Friday night football game. Kids wanting to show up at practice vs stay home and play video games. AAA had accountability (which most pahl orgs did not). Today it is probably different with dillusuonal parents. But when my kid played he moved to AAA because he was annoyed with the level of responsibility, accountability and dedication in the team, organization and league.
    4 points
  14. I have said this 100 times. But I'll say it again. Kids need to pick a college based on the college they want to got to, the curriculum and the campus. If they have hockey, bonus! But club hockey (unless they are getting $$$, which means D1 in a sports scholarship and D3 typically a large academic scholarship ) should not drive their decision. Just my 2 cents.
    4 points
  15. If we were to eliminate (or neutralize) the names highlighted in this claim and just broaden it with a different location/region where nobody really knows any specifics (i.e. “The Ice Shed in Thunder Bay, ONT” or “The “Cow Castle in Green Bay, WI”), and link it with their local amateur hockey organization…I am sure that I’d be one of many people that would dismiss it as hyperbole, too far-fetched, and absurd to even consider it as having any legitimacy. I’d think, here’s someone that is trying to impress how POd they are with that place and are really making it seem waaay worse than the reality is. But, the sad reality is that it’s 100% true (well, maybe except for the roided out hockey parents…I know nothing thing about that—but I wouldn’t be surprised). What I do know is, Armstrong/Belmont is a “fair play black hole.” If your team name doesn’t begin with the letter “A,” forget about it. I think that they even tax you some FPPs off the top as soon as you enter the rink…just like they did back in the old country as tribute. Seriously, this is the only WPA rink that I have ever seen where the guys wearing stripes actually do think that everyone in the stands came to that rink in order to watch them call penalties…on the road team. It’s like they bait the opposition—especially the unknowing parents—just to instigate verbal aggression the very second anyone from the visiting team sniffles their nose, or squeaks a chirp following their absurdly called penalty. I’ve even seen rookie step-parents get thrown out of there, forced to do the silent walk of shame when they were only doing positive cheering—it was nothing disparaging at all. The parents were by simply cheering on the refs (albeit sarcastically) when the refs called one of their infamous invisible man penalties, or their crowd-pleaser of, “2:00 minor for tripping…over their own blue line”…on their way to the bench. SMH
    4 points
  16. ECHL average pay is somewhere in the 700/week range. Minimum is like 500-something and up to around 1000. Very few if any players around here would have the ability to make a team. It might be a "lower" league but when it comes down to it those guys are closer to nhl players than the best players around here are to the ECHL.
    3 points
  17. Just wait...... because you know it can't be far away. Every other female sport basically has had and maybe hockey already has too, the transgender athlete playing in the female division and the risk/probability of that causing injury. This sport is so f'd up from the top of USA hockey down through every level. Somehow the fun and enjoyment of this game needs to be placed back at the top of the priority list ahead of all of this other bullshit.
    3 points
  18. I think this is absolutely true. You can see from the discussions on this forum that girls hockey is unimportant to many. And it's obvious to anyone who pays attention at any organization that, even at the orgs that really care to try to make girls hockey work, the girls are less than a second thought. It was only a year or two ago that basically every organization was giving their girls only one practice a week - at some orgs, every other week - and often they were on Sunday nights. Or late Friday night. The reason for allowing girls to roster on an extra team is simple - to promote girls hockey in the region. And for many orgs the only way to make girls teams happen is to dual roster the maximum number of girls. The proposed rule justification says that it "could cost us a small number of girls teams". It surely will do that. What's hard to understand is why PAHL thinks that's not a big deal as implied by that wording. Of the 25-or-so organizations listed on PAHL's website, only 11 have even one girls team. And every season some teams fold while others arise, so that it's never possible to predict who will have a team or how many teams will be in a division. Because of the small number of teams, almost all girls divisions play reduced schedules - that is, the girls teams don't get the same 20 game seasons the boys teams do. The 19U division this season, for instance, had 12 game seasons. A girl who dual rosters on two girls teams won't end up playing 40 girls games on top of whatever coed schedule they have because girls teams normally don't get that many games and also because they probably won't get to every game for both girls teams either. As for girls missing coed games, I've coached both girls teams and coed teams that had girls who missed games for their other team. As long as everyone is up front about it, that situation is what it is. Normally you are either prioritizing one of the teams over the other all the time, or you make a case-by-case call depending on the opponents and/or the importance of the game. It's not ideal, but it's something teams have been working with for a long time. I'm not going to get into arguments about whether girls can or should play coed hockey at any level. I've long believed that girls should play coed at least through 12U because they get exposed to more players and more teams and there are more games in PAHL for coed teams as well as more tournament opportunities. I've known plenty of girls who handled 18U coed just fine. My experience is that as the players get older teams expect more and more from their players and I cannot imagine that most 16U/18U coed teams would tolerate players missing games because of their "other" team, whether the "other" team is a girls team or another coed team. So honestly I don't think that allowing girls to roster on both girls teams and boys teams is a big deal, because at the 16U and 18U levels girls tend to play for only one or the other anyway. PAHL has to make a choice between parents complaining that their male player is getting discriminated against on the one hand and the viability of girls hockey as a thing on the other hand. Personally I think this whole argument is a waste of air because nobody is really hurt by the current rule. Regarding the Tier 1 rule, it's really not that significant. I agree with it in principle, but in practice I understand that the primary Tier 1 organization in our area generally tries to keep players from also playing on PAHL teams anyway.
    3 points
  19. Yes, they probably will be behind the programs that I mentioned (except maybe Niagara) but as was pointed out by other members, D1 hockey is the one sport that is not as divided into "have's and have not's". The Michigan's, Minnesota's, BU's, and Denver's are going to be the programs that recruit the 18 year old's that get drafted in June, but because of the role of junior hockey, teams like Quinnipiac, Union, and Providence can compete and win by bringing in players that are 20-21 years old and compete at a championship level. RMU could and can compete with those teams, and having better facilities would help with attracting better players.
    3 points
  20. well aren't you just a ray of sunshine. I did some research : The Colonials got off to their best start in program history in 2021 at 11-3 and saw themselves ranked within the USCHO Top 20 for much of the season, reaching a program-best #17 in January. At 15-9 overall and 10-5-0 in AHA play, the Colonials earned a West Division title while boasting the AHA Coach of the Year as well as conference MVP, Rookie of the Year, and Defenseman of the Year. The top offensive team in AHA and one of the most prolific in all of college hockey, RMU's 85 goals was one of the highest totals in all of NCAA DI, and their 25% success rate on the power-play was tops in the conference. - this happens to be the SAME year the program was ended by the President. Schooley's team has reached four AHA title games and raised three championship banners since the start of the decade. After making the program's first-ever trip to the NCAA Tournament via an AHA postseason title in 2013-14, the Colonials ruled the league during the grueling regular season in 2014-15 and 2015-16, winning 24 games in each of those years. Additionally - several players from RMU have gone on to play professional hockey on some level. Then let's talk about the women's program - 4 women played in the Olympics - 2 earning medals. 3 banners for winning CHA and several women drafted into Professional Women's hockey.
    3 points
  21. If I am not mistaken, one of the things that RMU doesn't like about the Island facility is that it is off campus, and therefore not as easy for resident students to attend games at. This was one of the stated advantages that the on campus basketball arena had over the hockey arena. So I assume they hope they'll get more spectators at an on campus arena.
    3 points
  22. I think you have the right as a coach to ask the question, but the referee doesn't have to respond. I have seen plenty of respectful and productive conversations result from a question, but I have seen plenty that are not. At the end of the day, blaming the calls or the officials is like blaming the YMCA rink for painting the goal lines too close to the end boards. I mean, yeah, it can affect the game, and the home team has a better idea of what will happen, but both teams are still playing by the same rules.
    3 points
  23. Yes, an official has the authority to tell a team that he is only going to talk to one of the designated captains or only the head coach. In my coaching days, I had a number of officials tell me and my other coaches that they would only be speaking with the head coach. This was their way to keep the amount of grief they heard from the benches to a minimum. To answer your first question, a ref has NO obligation to explain a call to a player. I've had coaches get on me because "I didn't explain the call to the player". My response back to him was "that is called coaching and that is what you are here to do, I'm just here to call the game". I will always clearly say what the call was, but I'm not going to have a 5 minute conversation rehashing the play and why I made the call. I'll also only discuss calls if the coach is doing it in a respectful way. If they are screaming at me or my partner, I just ignore them and tell them that we will have conversation when they can do it at a "normal volume".
    3 points
  24. Does a referee truly "owe" an explanation for a call? My gut says no. If you had to explain every single call, you would never finish a game. I feel like people who say that a call wasn't "explained" really just want to yell at the referee to either get the call overturned or intimidate the official into not making the next call. That's not to say that there aren't officials making terrible calls, but, let's be honest, there are plenty of players making terrible plays too and they don't have to hear about it from everyone else in the rink. I haven't looked at a rulebook in years, but when I did, I remember reading something along the lines of the referee only has to talk to the team captain who is marked with a "C" on the scoresheet. The official can talk to other people as courtesy, but the official only has to talk to the officially designated captain.
    3 points
  25. Crazy thing is, while this seems like it might just be a ridiculous bitter post. It's spot on.
    3 points
  26. It's the same move Alpha has pulled many times. Rebrand as vengeance or you can't get ice Use our officials or you can't get ice Buy our team supplies or you can't get ice None of these have any benefit to the kids. Only to Alphas pockets
    3 points
  27. I said it from the day the team was announced. They will collect sponsor money, then at some point in the season the team will fold and the owner will walk with a pocket full of cash
    3 points
  28. Once they get to the 15U/16U age, it doesn't really matter as much, IMO. The gap in maturity has decreased..some of these kids are are playing PIHL Varsity against 18 year olds by this time. BY teams for Tier II don't make a lot of sense to me...put the best kids on the 16U AA team regardless of whether they are a 2008 or 2009. If you adhere strictly to the BY model, the organization's 16U AA will be weaker and if you have kids play up on the 16s, the 15s will be weaker. Until USA Hockey recognizes Tier II 15U, I don't see the point. When my son was a PeeWee, I thought it was preferable, but as the years went on and seeing him play PAHL16U AA , 18U AA and PIHL AAA, I started to think differently.
    3 points
  29. The PAHL could close the gap and seriously compete with the best Tier 2 18U AA leagues…if they evolve just a little and promote their league as a AA developmental league. Instead, the PAHL have apparently built an iron curtain around accessing any information about the member teams and players. You can find the team names and maybe the players names. But that’s where it ends. They keep any and all statistical information zipped up tight. It’s reminiscent of the Soviet Union during the Cold War. IMO, it’s myopic and has it’s whole foundation based on fear-laden principles. I fear that if it doesn’t adapt and keep up with the times…the outside influencers promising greener pastures might entice some people.
    3 points
  30. To see the dumbest rule in all of youth hockey ( and there are a lot of them ) in the fair play point system potentially going away would be a good thing. Then they can take another look at ties as there is no OT or shootout which is a joke.
    2 points
  31. No, I helped ref adult leagues for my local rink like 15 yrs ago.
    2 points
  32. Well said. This falls in the hands of USA Hockey and MidAm, two organizations that are run by incompetent people and good old boys. The incident report portal is archaic and very difficult to navigate, which is why many officials avoid calling penalties that require a report. Often, player and/or coach names cannot be located or a team is not properly listed. Right or wrong, this is a fact. I know some officials who take pride in what they do--few, but there are some. These are the people who when seen hitting the ice, the coaches, players, and parents breathe a sigh of relief. Then, there those who when seen hitting the ice, the coaches, players, and parents say, "Oh no--not this clown."
    2 points
  33. What a classless post by another angry parent trying to live vicariously through his kid. Calling out an official while hiding behind a message board handle, nice. Who are you to question a call? A missed call? Gimme a break. If you are such a knowledgable hockey person, why not start officiating so you can give back to the game. You would most likely no be able to handle even a 10U B game.
    2 points
  34. PA HOCKEY 2023-2024 "AAA AA & A" DIVISION FINAL - WEEK 18 CLASS DIVISION TEAM W L T PTS AAA 1 SENECA VALLEY 15 3 0 30 AAA 2 PETERS TWP 13 4 2 28 AAA 3 PINE RICHLAND 13 4 1 27 AAA 4 UPPER ST CLAIR 10 5 3 23 AAA 5 NORTH ALLEGHENY 11 4 2 24 AA 1 SOUTH FAYETTE 15 1 2 32 AA 2 THOMAS JEFFERSON 17 2 0 34 AA 3 LATROBE 13 5 0 26 AA 4 FRANKLIN REGIONAL 10 6 2 22 AA 5 NORWIN 9 7 2 20 A 1 MARS 15 4 0 30 A 2 INDIANA 15 2 2 32 A 3 SHALER 15 3 2 32 A 4 QUAKER VALLEY 16 2 1 33 A 5 NORTH CATHOLIC 12 5 2 26 A 5 CHARTIERS VALLEY 18 0 0 36 B 1 CANEVIN 17 0 0 34 B 2 BURRELL 14 3 0 28 B 3 DEER LAKES 10 6 1 21 B 4 NESHANNOCK 13 3 1 27 B 5 CARRICK 11 4 2 24
    2 points
  35. yep that's correct. parents complain about parent coaches in youth hockey. now you have parent coaches in travel beer league teams too.
    2 points
  36. Starting 2/16/24, all ADS for any purpose, tournament, books, training, etc. are NO LONGER FREE Due to rising costs and expenses for me running this "FREE" forum, it is now necessary for me to charge for all ads. NOTE: At this time this does NOT apply to "teams seeking players" All ads are now $50 per posting, and must be pre-arranged by Private Messaging me or by completing this form If you post an ad without contacting me first, your ad will be deleted, and you will get a spammer strike. I will be posting further information in this post about the payment methods that I will accept. I will also be posting a link to donate to the board to help keep it running. Any questions? Message me. Thanks, PB
    2 points
  37. Ooohhhh, nnnoooooooooooo!! Say it ain't so!! Let me guess, Chris Cunningham.
    2 points
  38. the rumor is true the head coach was fired. He was replaced by someone on the teams father now.
    2 points
  39. The non profit will be a write-off for the good Dr. for all of his "donations" to the Vengeance AAA teams. The positives are 1. You will get a coach/GM that can out drink any of the parents and just got off of his 2nd DUI. He will coach your kids while on house arrest and wearing his ankle monitor. 2. You get professional EX athletes as coaches that will teach the dads how to cheat on their wives when they go out of town. 3. You get the flashy locker rooms with the fake walls that you have to walk 1/8th of a mile and through another building to get to the rink. 4. You have the "state of the art gym" that only 6 kids at a time can use but that's okay because they have a shooting area smaller than the one in your basement and 1/20th of a basketball court. You also get the front "lounge area" with the high top bar tables. Can't forget the video room that doesn't hold the whole team so kids sit on the floor. But you do get some cool swag and jerseys.
    2 points
  40. I encourage you to signup to be able to interact with our community. However, due to a recent influx of spammers, all new member registrations will be manually approved by me. Thanks and please be patient with your signups. If you've signed up and not received an email verification, or are having another issue getting access to the forum, please complete this form here: https://www.wpahockey.net/index.php?/contact/ Paul
    2 points
  41. 2 points
  42. They also have this guy in their organization https://www.wpxi.com/news/local/owner-sharpsburg-car-dealership-accused-ripping-off-customers/WLK4JJI6IRCI3OFVKCLJN64ZDQ/
    2 points
  43. Looking at the scores and competition from the AHF, I don't think it makes any sense to travel across the state to play in that league.
    2 points
  44. ACHA and similar levels are a chance to continue playing at a meaningful and competitive level without expecting "what's next?" Leagues like these are for the players who stood out in high school, "AA" or "AAA" (if it's from one of the several sham "AAA" teams). It's not exclusive to those groups naturally and worth trying out depending on where you go to school. It's fun and satisfies our competitive nature. It's not bad to watch and gives collegiate kids something to do for a few years. Reading through these comments it's fascinating to some users overthink what it means to play ice hockey and what the end result should be. At the end of the day best case scenario is we're all watching on TV but for 99% of us it's just the memories and friends that matter most.
    2 points
  45. Remember, it's all about your child. Find a fun environment that focuses on developing enjoyment for the game and puts them in a position to succeed at a localized level. Do not drain your bank account for a youth sport. The extra "A" is the worst return on investment imaginable in youth sports. Talk to your child and know what brings them joy in the game and why they like a particular program. Most of the time, it's their friends that are why they have fun. You will eventually be faced with predatory organizations that make promises and insinuations that they can give your child an edge. The real question is, what edge are you looking for? Schools? Pros? Do not have ideations of cheering your son or daughter from the press box at PPG. Just enjoy the fact they get to play the game and help them along. Another user mentioned 14u/16u as when you can safely determine if an investment is needed. That's fair, and your wallet will thank you. Never lose sight of the fact that it isn't about you--it's about your child and what is best for them. If you enjoy reading, I recommend Mark Hyman's Until it Hurts. It's high-level, focusing on youth baseball, but the point is the same. These are children and not mini-professionals. As far as a program, start with the closest rink and go from there. See where his friends are and where brings him the most joy.
    2 points
  46. A few thoughts on this…. I do not agree with coaches running their own players in private lessons. This has potential to creat multiple issues. If an organization is “AAA” they have to be able to hold a tryout, see the lack of talent and scrap it moving forward. Credibility of your organization takes a hit. However now that youth hockey is more of a business these days the likelihood this happens is diminishing. Takes advantage of parents who are not as educated. I look for an exodus of players back to AAA at the 09 birth year. PAHL is just a one and done for many of those kids. It’s a shame as it’s made for some good AA hockey locally. We will see where loyalty lies
    2 points
  47. Puckcovid19 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 In more ways than you can even imagine, my friend!
    2 points
  48. I think this is also going to cause issues in terms of playoff seeding/who makes the playoffs. Teams wrap up their season this weekend and have no idea where they actually stand because FPP are not accurate with incomplete box scores.
    2 points
  49. And that is why people who are not part of this cult realize how bad it is for Pittsburgh hockey....
    2 points
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