Pucks11

So what the judge is saying is that Montour once again did not file all the proper paperwork even for court. ✔️ Maybe Smith and Butz the high powered attorney's should stick to what they actually practice. 

11 minutes ago, Baleout21 said:

Are you positive?? Or just assuming??? 

You have seen their paperwork??

If it wasn't then we wouldn't be where we are right now. All they had to do last week was show the transfer paperwork and all they had was that he lives in the district. They filed the wrong paperwork and now they got caught for the 3rd time this season lying on paperwork.

Their argument in the paperwork they filed to sue is claiming they had a verbal conversation with the now passed away representative of PIHL and that it should stand because he supposedly said yes to them.

1 hour ago, Ihearthockey said:

Ok, so I'm going to do this again

The student is a billeted player, unless a court-appointed guardianship is in place between the player and the hostfamily. This does not pertain to foreign students who have been approved by USA Hockey

Is the student a billet, living with somebody other than his parents out of state for the purposes of playing hockey? YES/NO

Did the student's parents sign over guardianship to the billet family? YES/NO

Did Montour submit the paperwork to have this student treated as an exception to the Athletic Intent rule? YES/NO

Did PIHL approve the exception paperwork? YES/NO

Seems to me that the last two questions are what need to be clarified.  I would have to imagine that PIHL can still approve the roster if the paperwork wasn't filled out correctly because PIHL would not have known that the kid was a billet.  That would alleviate PIHL of any responsibility in the matter.  However, if the paperwork was correct, and PIHL did approve via some sort of documentation, then I would agree that PIHL has some culpability here.  We keep coming back to this darn paperwork don't we.  Where is it?

The answer is NO to all 4 questions. They listed the kid as a Montour resident like he has lived there his entire life.

2 minutes ago, Flavio said:

Let me frame it for you this way… what is going to prevent this from happening again? What can PIHL mandate, under their umbrella, to avoid this issue moving forward? 
 

You’re the one who’s being obtuse. Answer my question. 

Nothing will prevent it from happening unless the punishment becomes harsher maybe. Don't just take wins away and fine them, suspend the program for a year. From reading posts on here other organizations are the reason these papers were created in the first place. PIHL is a non profit so how many people can they really hire to go over thousands of kids paperwork in a timely manor? I am sure people volunteer to help but that only goes so far.  Apparently this is something that NEEDS to be addressed again since another school try to pull this stunt off after they implemented new rules.

1 minute ago, Stinger17 said:

I wasn't specific to a team or individual(s), but reading thru this thread it's pretty clear that some people have an ax to grind with Montour hockey (board, coaches and parents) that goes beyond this issue of eligilibilty.... I'm not sure how the number of goalies in their program has anything to do with this? They didn't have enough and now they do.

Different names living in the same house should not raise a question in today's world. It's called divorce, never married, blended, multiple baby daddy's etc. That alone shouldn't raise an alarm.

Montours argument at the beginning of the season was that they only had 1 total goalie to play for JV and V which is is why they NEEDED this kid so bad yet they somehow ended up with 4 playing. There were other schools able to pull off the whole season with 1 goalie but Montour just couldn't do it.

I see what you mean about blended families but it would still raise a question and with that excuse would be an easy answer.

18 minutes ago, Flavio said:

Pucks11 is invested - he was at the meeting and if that’s all they have on Montour, then MT is about to clean house with these people. 
 

“THey DiDnT fiLe tHe CorReCt paPeR wOrK jUdge”… 

 

So why didn’t you tell them that in the first place. 
 

LOL
 

- Judge Flavio

You really can't comprehend simple sentences can you?

How was PIHL supposed to know they didn't file the proper paperwork at the beginning of the season when they listed the kid as a current resident and not a transfer.

You are either that dumb or just dense as hell.

2 minutes ago, Flavio said:

Maybe. 
 

But atleast I’m not curtain jerking outside of PIHL court. With my ear pressed to the door. 

You wouldn't have to stand outside as they are open for anyone unless deemed emergency or private ???

10 minutes ago, Stinger17 said:

Agree!!!!

I would bet money that the people that reported this to PIHL at some point had a conversation with the former Commissioner (RIP) and did not like the answer he gave them.

The 1 team that posted claimed "to be after them" beat them this season. What did they have to gain? The guy they claimed from that team to turn him in kid plays the same position at their club team.

Montour supposedly couldn't find but 1 goalie for the season between JV and V but have a total of 4 listed between to 2 for the season ???

Just now, Flavio said:

HOW DID HE TRANSFER IF HE NEVER WENT TO A HIGH SCHOOL BEFORE? 

He still changed school districts, PIHL covers Varsity, JV and Middle School. It doesn't matter if he never attended a high school before, he still moved schools.

You must be fun at parties man.

2 minutes ago, Flavio said:

Explain how they filed the wrong paper work. 
 

The address he listed was clearly the billet address if they found that it was the same as his billet family, where is the lie? Sounds like at worst, Montour filled out papers and someone on PiHLS end didn’t do their due dilligence. 
 

No one is buying the “second look over” thing either. Drop that asap. Original poster even listed the the organizations that were “after them”. 

I have explained ii to you MULTIPLE , it's not my fault you can't comprehend it.

Yes the address was clearly the billets which is why is raised the question how 2 kids with different last names were living at the same house and there was no transfer paperwork filed but just the basic resident paperwork.

You don't have to buy the truth my guy, I know the process and that is 100% the truth. They do a 2nd look at every kid before playoffs start as a just in case.

Just now, Flavio said:

Oh I bet lol 

They went over everything again, likely excuse. 
 

Seems more and more like you may be one of the strongest opponents of Montour. So your credibility is shrinking by the minute. 

Dude you want answers and then argue every one you are given.

Montour filed the wrong paperwork on purpose and the kid was approved, when PIHL did their 2nd look at the end of the season to make sure everything was in order they found that the kid had an address the same as another player and that's when the questions started swirling about who he was and why he never came up under Montour before.

I know simple reasoning is hard for you to understand apparently but that's how the process works and went down.

4 minutes ago, Flavio said:

Again, the judge is going to look at this and ask why the kid was able to play 10 games without anyone noticing / now it’s an issue. 
 

What procedures are in place to ensure these rules are followed? Why did they fail? The asinine part is that PIHL will probably come away with this by having a rep at each game to verify players. But maybe they should be required to do that if they indeed are telling players they can play, then recanting later on. 

How many times do you have to be told that Montour never filed the proper paperwork. Yes the kid was approved to play as a resident of Montour who wasn't a billet or transfer student. They lied from the beginning.

PIHL goes over all the paperwork AGAIN at the end of the season just to make sure everything is in order and it wasn't.

5 minutes ago, GrumpyOldPucker said:

They could have presented evidence and PIHL said "Nope.... not good enough".... That's why I asked if the PIHL prez can make a unilateral executive decision contrary to (or circumventing) established rules? Might come down to how the PIHL rules are written. Could we see a re-write for clarification over the summer?

Montour never filed the PROPER paperwork, they filed the paperwork they wanted under false pretenses. They knew exactly what they were doing when they did it and they are now mad that they got caught. Montour never stated that the kid was a billet or transfer student from Ohio because their arg5eas that he was never in high school before so there for he was not "transferring" to Montour.

4 minutes ago, Flavio said:

How can you say what the evidence is? Do you know what they have. If they have documents from PIHL stating the goalie can play, look out.  We both know that group isn’t attaching their name to something this unorthodox if they don’t feel it has strong legs. They will get a prelim soon and theoretically it could be addressed soon. 

If they had the paperwork saying he could play then they would be in the playoffs right now. That's the problem with the meeting held last week at Ice Castle. Montour could NOT provide the proper paperwork saying the goalie could play. They have paperwork saying that he lives in the district and is not a transfer student, which is a lie and why everything is where it is.

Kind of funny how Montour had the money for the Varsity, JV and Middle School teams to play in playoffs but when they attempt to sue they have to pull all of their teams because they don't have enough money.

Nothing like screwing over your other teams.  Obviously the board only cares about 1 team in that organization.

There would be no problem if Montour would just show PIHL the that the proper paperwork was filled out. The problem is they can't, because they never filed the proper paperwork.

Like Peter said, the playoffs will be over before there is even a date set to read this IF it even gets approved to be heard.

25 minutes ago, fafa fohi said:

Fact - Montour is not in the playoffs.  
 

Maybe, just maybe you should stop crying, take the L and move on. It’s over. Most of the Montour loonies have left but you’re still here playing the victim.  Stop placing the blame on others and look within the Montour program. 

Not over yet, Montour won't go away. They are preparing to sue come Monday.

Nothing like blaming everyone else except for the person/people responsible

2 minutes ago, Stackthepads said:

fafa fooli-

maybe…maybe he should not have been approved by PIHL before the season on the official roster….maybe they should have folded their JV team since games overlapped on the same nights, maybe Scotty Bowman should not have been allowed on their bench, maybe Conner McDavid shouldn’t have snuck into a game as the 21st player that apparently played with a cloak of invisibility…lots of maybe’s.  But that’s what get these chats going, lots of maybe’s, assumptions, and hearsay with very few facts.

Maybe he was approved because Montour didn't fill out the proper paperwork (which has been proven) because the coach has a scetchy history as it is and it continued into the season with his 2 suspensions. Montours big excuse is that he wasn't a transfer because he wasn't in highschool last year but only 8th grade. 

The facts are the coach knew exactly what he was doing in this situation and if Montour players or parents want to be mad then be mad at him. It is no one else's fault.

1 hour ago, Stackthepads said:

You are correct- it was not Patrick Roy.  Funny thing is that if it were him, he would be fine to play because he is foreign.  From another state in the USA and not here for the purpose of playing high school hockey- nope.  BYW Definitely the best 14 year old goalie in the league.  I heard montour has a first year squirt prodigy goaltender from Buffalo that they may try to sneak in the next few years to compete at varsity.  His parents are renting an apartment in the district while they remain in Buffalo so they could prove residence for a couple years.  This conspiracy runs deep.  Beware.  Of course pucks11 already heard about this from his (not) reliable sources.

???

28 minutes ago, Stackthepads said:

So now it is the kids responsibility to know all the eligibility and rule intricacies of sports leagues???  Obviously you were hit in the head by 11 pucks- thus the screen name.

???If that is what you took from that whole thing then yeah sure??

8 minutes ago, Flavio said:

Wives running around queefing at people too. It all makes sense. White trash. 
 

Im not saying Montour isn’t wrong. Maybe they had 6 meetings on how to subvert the rules. Whatever……. WHATEVER. 
 

The point is others sat back and watched. Then used this as a strategy to benefit them by way of proper timing to make a fuss. They should be cast in the same light as Montour if Montour was indeed shady about it. 
 

If it was addressed immediately, then that’s fair game. Months ago. Goalie doesn’t play and no other Montour kids suffer. However, grown adults used this as an ace up their proverbial sleeve knowing that a roster of teenagers would be collateral. It’s pathetic. If it was Avonworth, I hope your boys learn a lesson and get your asses kicked the first game. 
 

PATHETIC. It’s a high school sport, stop all the queefing and go beat the other team. Not in western PA, it’s always a conspiracy, or the refs, or the zam driver. 
 

- DR FLAVIO 

 

 

GOOD GRIEF 

You are a very salty person to have no dog in this fight.

Stop blaming everyone except for who needs to be blamed.

Who cares if someone waited until the day before playoffs to start to bring it up. The fact is Montour cheated and got caught. Blame the coach and the parents in the organization that knew they did something wrong and just hoped they wouldn't get caught. If the parents from Montour knew what was going on with this kid then you know damn well the players knew what was going on also. Yes you want to feel bad for the kids but if any of them knew then they are just as guilty as the parents and coach for not stopping it from happening.

You are the only one coming up with the conspiracy theories and then wishing I'll will towards another group of INNOCENT kids.

7 minutes ago, Flavio said:

When you speed by the same cop every day for 6 months, he watches you, and basically waves. Then he pulls you over on 6 months and one day, you have an argument as to why he failed to do his job the 6 months prior. As such is PIHL in this case. If you had a dash cam showing the cop letting you go, the judge would let you off in a heartbeat. 
 

Doesn’t make you right, but why was everything allowed to pass until a convenient time? 

I get what you are saying to a point.

It is my understanding that PIHL does their initial review at the beginning of the season and then they do another at the end before playoffs to make sure everyone is up to par. Maybe upon this review they noticed that something was wrong with the goalies paperwork. Who really knows unless someone comes out and admits to being the person that blew the kids spot up or if PIHL really just happened to catch it. Either way the blame goes on the coach and the coach only.

Just now, PirateMan said:

Do you know what cheating means? How does accidentally rostering an extra kid who didn’t even play in the game, and having an extra “coach” on the bench give montour a competitive advantage? You think you know what you’re talking about but you don’t. You can put “third” in bold all you want but get your facts right first.

All 3 are facts, the coach knew what he was doing and knew it was illegal and still chose to do ALL 3. If it were 1 of the 3 then maybe it was an accidental but it wasn't.

15 minutes ago, forbin said:

Purely curious and I apologize if it’s already been discussed here, but what were the other two incidents of cheating this season? 

No worries, it was but there have been a ton of messages over the last few days. The first time the coach was supposed this season was because of an unrostered coach on the bench, then the 2nd time the coach was suspended was because he got caught with to many kids dressed for a game.

6 minutes ago, Stackthepads said:

What are you saying pucks11?  “Their goals per game go up” if you take the goalie away?  Do you mean goals against per game?  And do you mean “still did it anyways?”  So confusing…just like all the other non-sense people THINK they know.

It was so confusing that you broke it down word for word. ? Nice try on the put down bud. ?

How about you and the other Montour parents stop blaming everyone except for who is to blame. It is actually that simple. It's not PIHL fault, it's not QV fault, it's not Avonworth fault and it's not some parent who's kid plays goalie with that goalie for a club teams fault. Place the blame where it lies and stop defending them. Yes it sucks for the kids (seniors) but it wasn't the first or second time that Montour got caught cheating this season, it was the THIRD time. This one just happen to bite them in the ass.

1 hour ago, Ihearthockey said:

It's on the home page.  It's the only bracket with the first round filled out.  

21 minutes ago, PirateMan said:

It’s sad that the team that had more goals than any other team by 20 can’t play because of this. Even without the goalie, probably the best team in A.

Probably not considering they were 6th in goals against. If you take that goalie away their goals per game go up by almost a gola and a half and drop them to 10th in the division.

It's sad that grown adults that Knew What they were doing was not right and still did it anyways.