Pucks11
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Posts posted by Pucks11
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48 minutes ago, hockey2020 said:
if you think a kid who isn’t a good player makes it onto the team bc his dad pays more than the other kids that is nonsense. there are political picks to some extent at every organization but generally speaking pens don’t gain anything by picking someone’s kid who can’t play. the good kids will pay and the bad kids will pay. they prefer the good kids and make the same amount of money. if your kid doesn’t make the team you say it’s political. silly.
The Pens gain a ton of money by picking the kids with the parents that fall for all of their extra bullshit. Excel is a joke for the younger kids. The Mites Elite is a money grab. Their learn to skate programs are a HUGE money grab with how many kids they put on the ice compared to teachers.
I can tell you that there us a cops kid on an Elite team who openly admits that his kid ISN'T good enough to be on the team but he is because he got one of the higher ups brothers off on some charges a few years ago.
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1 hour ago, ctil20 said:
Going to end this debate before it takes up 19 pages. The Pens do an overall great job with these kids. However you can visit any program in America and find parents who have gripes.
Like being a human on this earth, not everyone is going to like you based upon how they perceive reality. It’s a fact of life.
What I will say is the Vengeance folks should really just focus on their program instead of the near constant obsession and attempts at “one upping” what goes on in Cranberry. There are a few people who come here and stir the pot about the Pens, to which I say, there is a a treasure trove of things we could talk about with SOME of the Vengeance people and SOME of the birth years down there...
Yet I never see Pens parents, Pens employees or anyone else for that matter.. looking to air laundry on here or in general conversation around rinks.
It’s always the Vengeance pens complex that gets the conversations started. And people, even those of us who may have had kids at Pens, kids at Pens currently, or kids never even involved with Pens are tired of hearing it.
If you want to talk about it though, some of us are willing to get into some finite detail of what goes on at the Vengeance regarding some of their processes for creating teams and SOME of the parents having influence.
disclaimer: there are some great hockey people involved at Vengeance. No blanket statements above. With that said, nobody cares about NHL players coaching. You cannot say the Pens are selling dreams, and in the same vein, tout that the Vengeance have NHL players for coaches. I don’t have any experience with the former players there, but if you really want to talk about who’s selling dreams.. The Vengeance are practically taking out billboards advertising this.
Whether or not these NHL’rs are good coaches isn’t for me to say, I certainly hope they are and that them being a “great coach” benefits the Vengeance kids. Playing in the NHL doesn’t automatically equate to teaching youth players skills and game play though, so again, if you want to talk about selling dreams...
I can agree with most of what you said here. The overall great job with the kids yes BUT only at the older age groups they openly admit to not worrying that much about the kids until midgets.
The Vengeance are taking the Pens best kids a little at a time because they are learning to play hockey as a team where the Pens seem to focus on a few good kids and just round their roster out with whoever pays the most money. Yes that problem is everywhere in youth sports, it's really sad. If the parents could put their egos aside youth sports would be a lot more fun.
You must know the Pens parents that fork out the money for their kids if you never hear them complain or run their mouth. We were up there for 3+ years and that's all I heard sitting up there 3-5 nights a week.
You can say that at the Vengeance about parents buying their kids a spot but somehow they are getting better each year ???. They keep the core kids and cut ties with the weaker ones, they have probably had the most turnover at the younger age groups and it has been for the better so far. While you take a look at the Pens teams and they keep getting worse each year because they allow mommy and daddy to buy their kids a spot on the mighty Elite team.
I do agree with the just because they were in the NHL doesn’t mean they will make good coaches but 2 of those guys have a pretty good track record with the development of the younger kids and the Pens ran them out for the uppers buddies to come in.
The director of operations up there is Crosby's best friend and he tosses that around when he goes out.
You want to talk about selling dreams, how many kids from the PPE (since they became PPE) have made it to the NHL? A big fat 00. The Pens ride the old name with those posters of NHL’rs on the walls that NEVER stepped foot in that rink.
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Laughable how might I ask? This board is filled with complaints about PPE. They have not been practice per usual. And yes the New England area is playing with that area only and not bringing in teams from outside those few states. You say that the Pens are the premier program yet they are being beat by local teams at various age groups that cost half the price. We used to think that also until we saw everything first hand the last few years.
It's Laughable that you guys bring up parents running the teams at Vengeance when 1 birth year team at PPE has gotten worse each year because of 2 parents calling the shots and people just straight up leaving. Didn't the 1 Elite team have 8 kids NOT even tryout from last years team? The 2 BEST kids and a goalie because he got ran out by another deep pocketed parent. ???.
I like how you took the saying that EVERYONE has for PPE (Pens and friends) and tried to turn it around on the Vengeance, you must still believe in the PPE bullshit they sell you.
Keep on laughing when you people are dishing out thousands of dollars MORE to get beat by local teams that ACTUALLY develop kids and pick the BEST kids not the kids who's parents have the deepest pockets.
We have no affiliation with the Vengeance either but why are the Pens afraid to schedule them this year also, they have asked multiple times? Maybe because they handled them pretty well last season and they can't be embarrassed by a local team again or people may start NOT buying into their bullshit anymore.
The PPE ran all of their best coaches out, they lost their best skating and skills guys all to bring in buddies of the guys running the place. The Vengeance have what 4 or 5 former NHL players coaching there and 3 are former Penguins not even offered a position hell they actually ran 2 of them out of UPMC because of buddies of the higher ups.
You can cry all you want what I said was from experience there and from talking to parents that are still there and upset with how they are handling this year especially not having any games scheduled and teams started playing this past weekend.
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Was a part of that organization for a few years and decided to leave with all of the false promises. I still talk to a few parents and with the organization and they have barely had any practices let alone talked about games(which they haven't). At the end of a practice 2 weeks ago the coach pulled the kids/parents aside and told them that they know there are a lot of rumors going around about their organization but don't believe any of it. A couple of parents are giving them a few more weeks to start producing SOMETHING or they are asking to be released. 1 parent sent the director of operations an Email asking about the season and he got a "there will be a season" message back with nothing else to it. They can't travel to Canada until at least January and by that time the season is almost over. Detroit is pretty much just sticking to Detroit and canceling a lot with teams around here, Boston (New England Area) are closed to outsiders. There are other local organizations with 30+ games scheduled and the parents at the Pens barely know when their next practice is. There are 2 local teams trying to schedule with the Pens and they were shot down or ignored through calls/texts and Emails.
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10 hours ago, Danner27 said:
I’m thinking it was the junior Sabers, I can’t be sure as it was sometime ago. What saw would give zero skill development. Just my opinion. I still think checking should go back to peewee.
Maybe it was the Buffalo Saints, they are one that tries real hard to catch the money flow but they never really develop their kids well even at the older ages.
I agree with the checking.
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2 hours ago, Danner27 said:
As stated above a few years ago. I saw one of these genes in Buffalo, Watched about a period. There may have been a total of 5 shots on goal for both teams. Sure it was good cardio but there was ZERO development going on. One kid on each team trying to get breakaways.
Must have been a bad game, it happens. I know the kids that my son played with developed pretty well. The coach they had taught them to play as a team. Yes there was the occasional stretch pass or end to end but all in all I think that it helped for the following years to come that they were playing already.
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14 hours ago, BACKCHECKING said:
(Hearsay)
I have heard that they use a local AAU team to play in some AAU tournaments in MI.
Why do they only play each other?
My son played AAU full ice Mites and it was pretty cool. We went to Michigan, Buffalo, Cleveland x2 and Rochester to name a few. There were some blowout games and a lot of really good games.
Yes every year there is some parent somewhere looking for the best kids because while I liked the half ice to start, there is only so much your kid can learn doing that. If your kid is good and has played half ice for 3 or 4 years they get BORED and if a kid gets bored with something what are they going to do??? (Quit).
If I remember correctly the teams out of Chicago, Cleveland, Rochester, Buffalo and some Canadian ones were named after their respected AAA teams at higher levels.
My son also plays roller and dek-hockey, in dek they teach the kids 5 vs. 5 Full rink with positions at the 4-6 year old age group.
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5 minutes ago, Danner27 said:
Like I said. I talked to the dad. Predators was the only tryout but this dolt doesn’t seem to believe it. I’m not selling anything, I don’t make any money in hockey, my involvement anymore is to watch other family members and friends kids play. Mine are both done now.
I talked to the dad also as my son played with the other son the day they got tested.
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1 hour ago, 1&done said:
Hahaha. This is why I think you know less and less on the daily. Do you know what refs make to get the opportunity to deal with parents like you and danner? If I were a ref I'd be in your corner, cancel the season.
You are so bad at assumptions, yet you continue to make them. That's my problem with you two, and why I assumed danner27 was your wife. You're the biggest hypocrites and you're brazenly ignorant to any differing opinions. Danner27 is 100% sure that the North Hills kids chose option 3, based on his text messages, as their 1st choice to play AAA this year. The fact that he wouldn't even consider those 2 North Hills kids probably got cut from option 1 and 2, probably went to all 3 tryouts together, is mind blowing. Look at a map...
I personally know the 2 North Hills kids and the Predators were their first choice.
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10 hours ago, Scooby Doo said:
My player is an 02 but he wouldn't touch PPE with a 10 foot pole. Twice in the past he went to tryouts, busted his butt and several goalies who weren't there before showed up for the last session before cuts, gave half an effort and they all make it meanwhile everyone else was cut. He's done with those politics. You can say we were a little heated after driving 90 minutes each way for like 4-5 sessions (TWICE) for this to happen TWICE.
This happens at the lower age groups also. The younger teams are getting players plucked away because of the politics up there. They don't care as long as they get their money. That's all that "non profit" cares about.
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4 hours ago, Danner27 said:
Nah won’t be until first cut, what day is that this year ?
Tonight is first cuts for Pens.
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14 hours ago, Denis Lemiuex said:
Oh, And please no AAU hockey. There's a reason why it hasn't taken off. Some teams in MI but it is horribly run, has no concern about the players or even the sport. It is nothing more than a money maker. You can rail on USA Hockey and some of it is justified but I promise you it is 1000 times better than AAU.
From my experience AAU was 1,000 times better. We didn't have to deal with politics or huge expenses like we have faced in USA Hockey. My son played at a high level against BETTER teams. Most of the time in the SAME rinks. There was BETTER travel and tournaments, it was cheaper, you can play whoever you want even USA hockey teams(they just don't put it on their schedules to not get into trouble ?). There are actually a lot of teams that my son's teams have played over the last few years that have a USA Hockey registered team and then play under another name for AAU(it's BIG in the Buffalo area).
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There are clinics (just posted yesterday) scheduled next weekend (May 9th and 10th) at a local rinks.
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Esmark is trying to take all the PPE 08 kids that don't make Elite and just give them a spot.
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6 hours ago, aaaahockey said:
Was this just to make ice time for the new girls teams?
And probably that NEW prep team!
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3 hours ago, BACKCHECKING said:
I understand all the issues that people have with AAA teams and they are not all wrong. The cost is considerably more, PPE is around $4800, and the Vengeance is around $2600 plus the cost of travel. With that being said both organizations do not have parents as coaches, would you rather spend less and have a coach who has no idea what he is doing and favors his child and his child’s buddies ( THIS IS NOT THE CASE WITH ALL PHAL ORGINIZATIONS SOME DO HAVE REALLY GOOD COACHES) or spend considerably more money and have professional coaches and a lot more ice time. This years PPE 2009 and 2010 BY teams are coached by Trever Edwards and the Vengeance 2009 BY team is coached by John Zeiler (Played for the LA Kings) the 2010 BY team is coached by Colby Armstrong.
Most everything else you said was true but this part not so much. MOST of the teams at PPE in the first 4 or 5 years have parent coaches on them whether head or assistant.
With the pricing that is about right but you do get a lot more out of the PPE with the higher price. YES they say sponsored by the local sports store but included in that big price tag is home/away/practice jersey and socks, jumpsuits, bags, 3 ice slots per week, 2 gym sessions per week, usually around 40-50 games and more. Most other organizations can NOT or DON'T give you that.
Ultimately it comes down to where your kid wants to be and if he can play at that level. Let it be about your KID and not YOU. That is the problem with a lot of organizations, parents can't keep their hands OFF.
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47 minutes ago, lferg said:
Is this NP 1 - 12U which has half of players from last year Pens Elite?
I am pretty sure it is 1 kids from the 08 Pens Elite and MAYBE some kids from the 07 Black team.
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8 hours ago, Paul Baxter said:
Congratulations to the following area players who were part of the KSG teams that won medals. I think this might have been one of the better showings by the West in quite some time. The South is as usual, loaded with Flyers Jr. AAA players, and I don't know if one male PPE played for the West or Central.
- West Region 12u - (2-1 record) - Silver Medal
- West Region 14u - (2-1) - Silver Medal
- West Region 16u - (2-1) - Silver Medal
- West Region 18u - (2-1) - Silver Medal
- Central Region Female - (3-0) - Gold Medal
- Central Region 12u (1-2) - Bronze
- Central Region 18u (1-2) - Bronze
There was an 08 PPE on the 12u Central Team.
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1 hour ago, Eddie Shore said:
So, was it because of checking or % rule? Which is it?
Checking and then when I pointed out the no checking it was the % rule.
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6 hours ago, fafa fohi said:
Your son's school needs to be brought up to speed on MS hockey as there is no hitting. It is one of the reasons why some parents with smaller and less skilled players are more open to MS hockey vs PAHL.
YES. I know this, but they still said NO because of the % rule too even though he would improve the team.
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I asked my sons school about him playing as a 6th grader and they said NO because of the hitting.
PPE - no games this season???
in Western Pennsylvania Youth Hockey
Posted
I agree with you on the prep schools watching.
The talent in Pittsburgh is there for 2 really good teams if ego's would be set aside.
I definitely agree that people will complain anywhere.
I never heard of a parent buying a spot at the Vengeance either and for the Lens to just recruit a kid from out of town, don't they supposedly pride themselves on kids from this area?
And I agree with it's nkt up to those organizations to get your kids drafted.