nemesis8679

I think they rank them pretty good. I think they do a good job with it. Although you often do have that one team that doesn't lose a game, or that one team that doesn't win a game. But I'm not sure that that's avoidable. And I think sometimes a borderline team may be moved up or down to add to, subtract from, or balance a division.

I've heard some say the two placement games could be used by an unscrupulous coach to "tank" to get a lower division, and I see how it could be gamed a little. But I'm not sure that it actually happens, and certainly not enough to worry about if it does. Or maybe your goalie has two bad games. Or maybe your best player is sick. But I'm not sure that happens enough to be concerned about. But the best thing to do is play a handful of games in addition to the placement games. They  allow you to enter any tournament games the team participated in, and you're also free to schedule a few of your own scrimmages and submit those scores. So I think that's a nice thing that they allow you to use a larger pool of games to judge by. And of course they're also looking at where the kids were before. 

Some places in other states don't do mixed year, and your first year in an age group you play A Minor and your second year you play A Major. And that's how Minor/Major is determined. I'm sure that has its good points and it's bad points.

Many areas also have it where your travel team is dictated by your location- if you live in X, Y, or Z district, you tryout and play for a determined team for that district. Now they do allow one or two moves, if something isn't a good fit or whatever. But there's no team carousel every year. 

Not sure how these ways of doing things affects rankings, if that would help/hurt the parity. 

But I'd say as it is right now seems pretty reasonable and fair. 

11 minutes ago, No Politics said:

I don't know of any '07 BY supplementals, but I do know that NP (as Saucy said), Badgers, and the Yetis still have tryouts within the next week.

I just received a message this morning stating the North Pittsburgh 07-08 registration is closed. 

20 hours ago, No Politics said:

I also just heard that the Huskies '08 BY team is holding supplementals next Sunday at 10:00am.  They have information on the Pittsburgh Ice Arena page.

And every time you hear of multiple supplementals in the same area, do you ever think "why don't they just combine teams?", or is that just me?  Ha ha.

Definitely not just you. It's frustrating seeing this happen, all the kids spreading out and leaving each team with 3-5 players that belong at the level they're at, and filling the team with whoever is left. 

9 hours ago, zam said:

The "perception the 

Because of that, out of town kids that want to play at the highest level and be seen by scouts travel to play for PPE.  So of course little Johnny Ringer from Sacramento comes here and steals a spot from a decent player from Pittsburgh. On the contrary, nobody is coming very far to play for Preds, SHAHA, Vengeance etc. So inevitably the best players from those teams move on to better teams as well. It's the competitive food chain, eat or be eaten. The pens could make a team of the 20 best Pittsburgh area kids each year, and they would be moderately successful. (Probably something like the Cleveland Barons) But the top players would always be leaving.

So we could agree that they must not be great at developing their own kids from younger age groups? 

7 hours ago, Icebucket said:

With PPE taking a handful of Vengeance players, it has to make you wonder if PPE got a bit of a wake up call at mid ams.

Recently they have been filling out the bottom half of their teams with out of town players who are no better than the local players they were passing on. All it's really done is made it easier for other teams to close the gap and knock them off with those same local players they passed on.

At 14s and 16s, PPE lost out to vengeance and barons who were both loaded with PPE cuts.

Do you think they take all the out of the area kids partly to create the perception that their org is so amazing, people come from miles around to join it? 

Reading the last several replies here, some random thoughts:

Paid coach, parent coach... if they're a good coach it's irrelevant if they're paid or parent. Hell, I know of paid coaches that never had hockey experience over playing in-line, and parent coaches who at one time played high level college or professional hockey. Do they know what they're doing, are they fair? That's the questions that are important. But telling your neighbors that your son's coach is the left wing's dad doesn't sound as cool as telling them how the coach is some part-time professional coach, right? 

Regarding Pens, as mentioned above, it's not just a hockey team it's a lifestyle. There's a lot of barriers there at older ages that make other options look better. So I'm sure tons of good players are off the table before getting on the table just on cost and commitment. 

On the subject of the AAA revolving door. Most parents (and some kids) think they're looking at a future of moving right to high level juniors, NCAA, and I'm certain some think they'll be in the NHL draft as soon as they turn 18. When they play at "x" organization and nothing really happens during the season aside from their team getting a number ranking on MHR, they aren't on the power play, or whatever grievance they have, they think it will be different on another team so they try to go there. With the number of "AAA" teams in the area, you can do this practically every year. And if you run out of teams, you can just start back where you started. This is all applicable of the revolving doors in AA and A also. 

Also, organizations at every level should put a ban on any coach coaching a team in the org, and offering skills lessons outside of team functions to any players they coach. Not saying they shouldn't be allowed to operate skills lessons, just not to players on their team. Under no circumstance is this a good scenario for anybody but the coach. It shouldn't need to be explained any further the ways in which this is a bad idea.  There's plenty of skills coaches around that you shouldn't need to be going to your coach for it. 

Most importantly- it's a game, it should be fun time for your kid. With the pressures/stress of school, girlfriends/boyfriends, looking at colleges, making time for other hobbies & interests, and plain being a kid growing up in the times we have today... hockey should be a place where kids can forget all that stuff, have fun, and NOT be stressed out over it. 

4 hours ago, kid310050 said:

They were holding tryouts for what looked to be a 16u team last night

Did it look like they had a fair amount of kids come out? 

2 hours ago, HatTrick said:

How can the vipers offer a higher level than current organizations in that area?  Are they fielding AAAA teams now?

To be honest, I'm not sure what the Vipers plan to offer, after what I've read on the board and heard at the rinks about them having little to no ice and bouncing around across various rinks, I didn't look into it any further. 

17 hours ago, Lucky17 said:

Let me ask another way, is there not a team or does the team above your kid’s team not have room?

Teams are pretty much set before "tryouts". 

16 minutes ago, Lucky17 said:

Curious who the current org is that you cannot move higher

Nevermind that. Doesn't matter. 

The sad thing is I would have my kid try out for Vipers, no problem. It's close, current org really offers no opportunities to move higher.... it could be a great thing to have Vipers as an option. 

But it sounds like it's going to be a damn mess. 

21 minutes ago, Novos51 said:

But then it wouldn’t be travel and parents would thumb their nose at it. Lol

I don't think so,  necessarily. It would be cheaper, less time-consuming, and maybe their kid wouldn't look out of place. Compared to a kid on a travel team, neither are realistically going anywhere other than ending up with a lifelong love of hockey and playing to have fun, if that's what they choose to pursue. 

21 hours ago, Icebucket said:

It's all just a trickle down. Half the AA kids play "AAA", then half the A major players get bumped to AA as a result 

Yeah that was my point

Good. 

What I think would help a ton is if there were a few more in-house leagues. This gives kids that aren't as serious or just want to have fun or something to do the option of teams to play on, without the commitment of travel hockey. As it is now, they end up in PAHL. Where some of them (or their families) don't really want to travel anywhere, and really aren't interested in playing competitive games. Some don't want to come to practice. Or have more interests than hockey. So what happens? They commit to travel teams because they're interested just enough to want to play, but not enough to work hard. So teams get watered down. 

Also fewer "AA" teams (you could say "AAA", too). You have so many AA teams, that most of them have a couple actual AA players and are filled out with A Major players. A Major then ends up having some A Major players, and filling out with A Minor players. Not sure there's a solution to this one though, not when bragging rights of an extra A and money are involved. 

48 minutes ago, hockeyisgreat said:

Sounds like it could be the next Faux AAA team in the area!  Too good for PAHL! Time to go independent!  Who wants to be the commissioner of the Faux AAA league in WPA!

Great place for Gary Bettman! 

What's ATC? 

The worst case scenario is he should be able to be placed on a team at the level he played last season. Especially within the same org. I know that doesn't help you getting to the next level, but at least he should be able to be placed no lower. 

How many organizations playing PAHL A or AA do you think really 100% take the best kids available to their team? Most of them? Half of them? A few of them? 

Should do half drills, half scrimmage. See who works hard and can follow directions, and see what they can do in game situations. 

And have a neutral evaluator from outside the organization score them. 

Not saying the organization's evaluators can't score them, too. But a neutral third party would help. Whether you think so or not, evaluators that know the kids will have bias whether intentional or not. Good to have someone with no horse in the race to say what they're seeing, too. 

8 hours ago, hockeyisgreat said:

Never hurts to try! Just as you go in with eyes wide open.  Please let us know what your son thinks of the experience. Just make sure he knows that sometimes being the best out there isn't good enough for PPE.

Thats true for way more teams than PPE. 

Look past the name, logo, and marketing. There's plenty of places to play good hockey. Besides, he'll likely get booted in a few years for out-of-towners. Save yourself the trouble. 

With tryouts approaching, I'm curious to know what people's experiences have been with the different orgs around here. Good coaching, bad coaching... Org culture... Decent ice slots, not decent ice slots... Not enough travel, too much travel... Fair evaluations, or buddy system... Cool jersey, lame jersey.....  Does the org seem stable? 

I'm curious of peoples' experiences. Might be helpful to newer parents. Not asking for anybody to be blasted, but if the ice slots suck let's be honest. If the coaching is great, say that. So let's hear it. 

So he was with teammates? I would hope if my son were in a similar situation that he wouldn't let a teammate do such a ridiculous thing. 

Well, his dad was a Flyer?