fafa fohi

I know it's very early, but it appears those that were writing off Esmark as a player in AAA need to take a look at the U18 level.  Based on games played so far they appear to be the class of this level in western PA.  PPE looks average ( got swept this past weekend ) while Vengeance is a mess and also got swept by OBJ with Preds and Icemen taking their customary spots at the very bottom.  

Fresh chum is now in the water - commence feeding.

https://myhockeyrankings.com/rank.php?d=MM&y=2023&v=118&view=alphabetic

15 minutes ago, Pa Hockey said:

Pa Hockey Scholastic Showcase 

Greensburg Pre Season 

Steve Bryan Armstrong 

Meadville Bulldog MLK 

How do these / if at all conflict with club hockey?  Are games during the week?  I noticed St. Margs did not conflict this year and games were on weekdays.

This does not address the current system where teams are on waiting lists but the same teams get boat raced every year.

1 hour ago, Pa Hockey said:

There are plenty of tournaments for High School teams to enter besides St Margarets FFO

Not local tournaments.

1 hour ago, Saucey said:

For some reason, there is never much fanfare regarding this tournament, info usually comes out later. Since teams are just getting their feet wet, I don't think this is a bad thing. I think the only game that is ever live streamed is the Championship. Check the Pa Hockey website for that information.

What I do not like about this tournament is many schools have been on a waiting list to enter the tournament for years, while some of the same teams get blown out year after year after year but continue to hold their spot.

What is the point to holding a spot for a team that goes 0-3 every year in pool play while not allowing other schools with stronger talent to enter because of a waiting list?

3 hours ago, nemesis8679 said:

Stat freaks for minor hockey teams? 

And I thought I had some useless hobbies. 

Seems someone has not spent much time on Elite Prospects nor have a clear understanding of AA hockey.   Could it be that your kid was the recipient of a bought extra A for flex purposes and bragging rights?

AA is not “minor” hockey,” especially U16 on up with the top tier teams as many kids go from AA to playing prep, juniors and / or college hockey.  Not all parents want to subject themselves to the cost, time, travel, headaches and expense that AAA offers.  If you had a clue you would know there are many AAA level players in western PA playing AA hockey for those same reasons.

As for those useless hobbies of yours, I can’t help you there.  Maybe you should make better choices in the future.

On 9/1/2023 at 10:56 AM, hockeyisgreat said:

Stinger, you are right on with all of this.  Hopefully the new PAHL format will change their antiquated ways.  I can't believe that they do nothing to promote the players within their league. Especially at the AA level 14U and above.  The kids that lead the league should be recognized.  They have had the information all along but choose not to show it to the public.  Not sure why!  I love the transparency of THF & AHF. Players of the week etc.  Gives the kids something to strive for.  They could have an Allstar game at the 18U, 16U and 14U.  But again they choose not to.  At least PIHL does that and makes the Stats readily accessible to all.

Other Tier 2 AA leagues throughout the country log stats within their own network, but many also do the same on Elite Prospects which has become the go-to for stat freaks.  Although the coaches / managers are the ones logging stats for Elite Prospects, it is not isolated within a few AA teams.

The dinosaurs within PAHL do none of this.

On 8/11/2023 at 11:45 AM, hockeyisgreat said:

They are hiding their Roster so that no one can Poach their players.  If you look you will see that Esmark does not have their rosters up either.   I also think some kids at 18U are trying to make Junior Rosters so haven't completely decided who they are playing for.  I've heard of a few 18Us that are going out of state to play next year.  Should be interesting when it all shakes out.

You clearly do not need a roster to poach players.  

8 hours ago, Danner27 said:

That’s not going to work out in the end. 

I’m curious as to why.  

20 hours ago, Pucks11 said:

0000000 kids from SHAHA advanced out of Midams to the camp 2 weeks ago and this past weekend.

Do you know how many Esmark and Vengeance 08 players made it to natty camp?

15 hours ago, forbin said:

Yeah because the front desk girl will have all the answers. Trying to effectively communicate with someone within the Preds organization is a complete waste of time.

15 hours ago, Pucks11 said:

No problem, you would get your answer faster and be able to talk more crap later.

My thought was simply this......there is a really good chance that a parent from this proposed U18 AAA team is a regular reader of this forum and would simply chime in and say "yay" or "nay."

This is where the benefits of having a local hockey forum like this really shine through.  If it makes you feel better I can talk crap now or should I hold off?

4 hours ago, Pucks11 said:

Just call Ice Castle and find out. Everyone is so worried about if this place will have a team or that place will have a team. Just call and ask.

Thanks for the solid - appreciate your help and feedback.

Has anyone determined if the Preds will have a U18 AAA team this season or not?

21 hours ago, hockey57410 said:

Again, who cares what other kids are playing. I’ve found PAHL AA parents are the ones who didn’t make whatever AAA program they are bashing. And don’t act like PAHL AA is a Powerhouse. Every blue moon there is a legitimate good team, but most often they’re just mediocre when put up against other non PAHL teams. 
 

PIHL is a joke as well, unless you’re in the AAA division. 

 Where did anyone here say that PAHL was a powerhouse?

There are plenty of AA level players that could make some of the top AAA teams in western PA.  Not all of them are kids that got cut at AAA tryouts - I have known many that were exceptional players that decided to play AA and not deal with the significant differences in travel and cost or were playing a secondary sport.

And many of those local AA teams that you call mediocre are usually in the top 15 nationally in Tier 2, and most play 20-30+ additional games against non-PAHL nationally ranked teams.

As far as your comment on only AAA in PIHL is legit, maybe you should have a word with some of those AAA coaches that lost to AA teams in past St.  Margaret’s tournaments.

23 hours ago, ice is cold said:

Which would make it an organization in PAHL issue, hence a PAHL issue as the orgs are in PAHL.  😁

So by your comment, would having shitty coaches at AAA ( yes there are many ) make it a AAA issue?

There are some AA coaches at multiple age levels that can run circles around some of the AAA coaches in western PA.  And anyone out there that thinks they are guaranteed great coaching at the AAA level is smoking some really good rope.

Just sayin'

2 hours ago, ice is cold said:

????? 

DW is part of the ownership group that bought the shithole that was Ice Connection and poured a ton of money into major improvements.  People that have issues with Frozen Pond today either have a very short memory of what the place used to be like or had never been there prior to it being sold.

24 minutes ago, nemesis8679 said:

You're right. The ice is awesome there. 😂

Agreed - in times when its hot during late summer the ice at Frozen Pond always held up.  IMO one of the best ice surfaces in western PA. 

1 hour ago, RJUSHL said:

Why do you say that nothing has changed over the years?

Your story happened a longggggg time ago. Not sure it's still relevant. You mention 3 PPE coaches as the only evaluators. That part has clearly changed. There were 7+ evaluators for 08s and 09s a few weekends ago. And so far no one has pointed out a single PPE coach that was there. There could've been one or two, I'm not sure. I know some of the PPE coaches in that bantam/midget age group, and none of them were there. I'm going to ask them how many PPE coaches (if any) were at tryouts a few weekends ago.

I think most of the people in this thread calling it a "sham" have been personally hurt by the process. It's not perfect, but from my experience over the past few years it's certainly a better process than many of the local Tier I and Tier II tryouts.

The negativity is just amazing. Everyone is a victim. Everyone has been screwed over by the system. I'm sure a lot of that has been passed down to the kids. What an exhausting outlook.

I haven’t and won’t play the victim card on this topic. I can remain pretty objective when it comes to any of my kids level of play and what they bring to these events  - both of them had some success by advancing - one survived the first cut and the other made it to the final weekend by playing in the “all-star” game. Neither made it to natty camp, which was the right call.

I have no axe to grind here, but I saw it for myself on multiple occasions of PPE kids advancing both to the finals and to natty camp whereas they were clearly not the best players there.  Seeing top level kids from Culver, Esmark, Tri State and others who turned heads at these events only to be denied in favor of PPE kids that were clearly outplayed.  And in some cases it wasn’t even close.

Call it what you want, I’ll do the same. 

“For anyone crying foul on the whole process, throw out some specific ways it could be improved. What are your ideas?”

You can start with independent evaluators that have zero interest in their former players advancing.  The fact that PPE coaches dominate this process is a joke.  I’ve seen it multiple times at the U14, U15 and U16 levels.  Get these “evaluators” to swap districts or bring in those that are not tied to any of the organizations.  Everything looks fair when the cuts go from 100+ to 60.  When it gets really fun is seeing the list of kids that advance to natty camp and see the sea of yellow buckets.

I will stick by what I said - it is a sham.

2 hours ago, RoyalTraveller said:

This is the kind of thing that devalues this board. You make a statement like this as if you know it to be fact and it's 100% false. Tier 1 coaches are allowed to evaluate the kids they have just finished coaching, but not allowed to evaluate kids they will be coaching next season. They know the tier 1 kids better than anybody.

 

This^^^^^

PPE coaches have been included in the evaluation process and lo and behold, many gold buckets always seem to advance ahead of those that were more deserving.  I think MidAms are a sham and a complete waste.

11 minutes ago, bb2j3z said:

Some of these posts are quite amusing.  From a view on the inside, here was no internal sabotage.

The person in question has two other kids in the organization and is a head coach of his youngest son's 2010 team.  He was also part of the group that did the rebrand/rename from Rink Rats while I was doing designs.  I think he just asked his oldest kid which team he wanted to play on and it ended up it was the one his friends were still at.  Every other family that declined made their own separate decision.  

It appears that Q has infiltrated this forum.

5 hours ago, Icebucket said:

I'd guess AA will be a few less teams. Last year you had Lebo drop down from AAA, and AAA was a team or two lighter than other years. This year you have Allegheny AA who won't play PAHL, and the icemen have an A/AA team who is playing AAA.

SCIR and NP both have very strong 16 groups moving up. Lebo should also be strong between their 18s who return mixed with SP 16s. Armstrong will certainly be AA as well. Beyond those 4, it looks like other teams broadcasting that they have AA teams are Predators, Viper Stars, and Westmoreland. Not sure they will all place in AA though. Am I missing any?

NP, SCIR, Foxes, Mt. Lebo, Armstrong, Preds will have teams for sure.  Allegheny will have a U18 AA Independent and possibly one playing PAHL as tryouts are going on now.  SHAHA should have a team as well.  The Viper Stars and had a supplemental last weekend and Westmoreland has one next week so who knows. 

15 minutes ago, bb2j3z said:

We had open tryouts.   From the bleachers, we had 1/3 open for parents to watch then you could watch from Bubbas at Printscape.

From our perspective, the number of declines brought this team down.   It was a pretty awesome lineup from a very competitive tryout.   We had 11 declines and exhausted the alternate list.   It was just a cascade of events and panic from families that didn't want to be left on a shell of a team.   Our process was coach calling the roster and getting verbal approvals then posting the roster list (pinnie numbers) then they have 48 hours to decline to receive back their commitment fee.   The 48 hr timeframe now seems too long + I like what North Pittsburgh is doing by cashing the commitments on making the roster.   Some joker sent their decline email one minute after the deadline.    We decided to just let it go.  Sad lol.

That sucks, especially since you had the headcount at tryouts to field one or even two teams.

Question - since your tryouts were open to spectators, do you think there was any chance mom or dad got in their kids ear to dissuade them from accepting their spot on the AA team because the parents felt it was not a good fit for their kid or that the grass may be greener elsewhere and the talent was not up to "their" standards?  My gut says "yes" but what do I know.  

16 minutes ago, RJUSHL said:

Would you propose eliminating the 14U AA Minor division from PAHL?

IMO, yes.  What good does it do?  Typically teams in 14U AA Minor are U13 BY teams and I assume it is only done in this division because it is their first year of checking and allows kids of similar age and size to compete as their intro to checking.

Unless anyone has another valid reason why there is a AA Minor division at only the U14 level?  

Adding another A division under a “AA Minor” moniker is not the solution as all you are doing is pacifying the adults and coaches for ego purposes.  Hell, its what everyone on this forum complains about all of the time with adding the extra A for those seeking placement on  “faux AAA” teams when they should be at the AA level. 

If your kid is not good enough to make a AA team regardless of age, so be it.  Play A-Major Black or a comparable level based on their ability and ranking at tryouts.

Not allowing commitment fees to be returned if players are placed on the top team is a step in the right direction and will prevent mom and dad from sending their kid to five different tryouts while only paying for tryout fees.  NP does this.

AA Major and AA Minor?  Why stop there - let’s go full throttle with AA Minor Mediocre and AA Minor Adequate.  

.