Lifelongbender

And she was the MVP of the first Buffalo Beauts championship in the NWHL. Hard to play at a higher level.

That looks like a fantastic event. I can't believe the OTB boys were there. Also, congrats to the guy who got to "square off" with Brett Keisel on the ice. That pic would go on my mantle forever. They look like they had a blast faking that fight.

Good.

Ahh, it would not be "double secret" if we knew about it. In fact that's about all they did receive.

Folks, both @Ref33 and @Saucey are right here, The officials on the ice, and off the ice, who were in the building explicitly have the responsibility - or at least the right - for responding to inappropriate behavior by spectators. See PIHL rule 9.2. However, this behavior was tolerated by every single person in the arena, and @Saucey has listed a number of the reasons people would likely give if asked. That's one reason there are constables at the games, and a big question is why the security personnel at this game didn't just tell those kids to shut up. I saw a constable at a JV game I recently attended do just that with student section which was much less over the line than this one. The on-ice officials should have taken action, as should the off-ice, facility officials, PIHL coordinators, and security personnel, not to mention the home coaches (it's my understanding that the Mars coaches did complain). All of those people are at fault here, and some should have their positions reviewed, in my view. Long and short, and the point that I believe @Saucey is making, is that this sort of thing won't stop until we as parents, coaches, and fans, refuse to tolerate it in our arenas (and, I'd add, our lives in general - these kids didn't learn that behavior in a vacuum). If someone stands up to a misbehaving fan, or fans, in the stands, don't turn away. We don't want fighting in our stands, but somebody has to be the adult out there. I called a guy out in the stands at a tournament a few years ago and ended up face to face with the guy, hands down, refusing to escalate, as he screamed at me until another parent from his group dragged him away. (I will admit to taking a picture of the guy as he staggered up to me so the cops would know who to arrest, and telling him that was why I took it.) It wasn't my intention to start trouble there, but to remind the guy that everyone else was trying to enjoy watching their kid play a hockey game. That was hard to do, and that kind of thing is ALWAYS hard to do, because you can't predict what will come of it. Now, I'm not normally the guy in the stands, but for my part I have spoken more than once to parents of players on my teams where the parent acted boorishly in the stands. We just don't tolerate that. We all need to do better, and expect better, of ourselves, our kids, and each other. If this incident teaches us nothing else, it should teach us that we can't rely on the folks who are supposed to react to this sort of behavior. It'll need to start with all of us refusing to tolerate it.

The next Mars game is Monday, November 8, at 8:00 PM, at Lemieux. PIHL is expecting a LARGE turnout supporting the Mars goalie, so they moved it from Baierl to Lemieux to accommodate the crowd. It would be amazing for a huge crowd to show up for this game, to support the goalie, but also to make a statement that the sort of behavior that occurred at Belmont is not accepted by the Pittsburgh area hockey community, and also that this sort of thing will not be tolerated. Several of the local 12U and 14U girls teams are planning to attend the game as a team. Good on PIHL and the rinks for making this change in support of the player.

I've known Howard for a few years, and had the honor of coaching with him for a season. He's definitely one of the good guys.

In the wake of the Kyle Beach hearings last week, and the baffling way the hearings were going on and Quenneville was still on a bench that day, and the despicable behavior at Armstrong we've been discussing in another thread, Bryce Salvador wrote an article that I think really speaks to some of the issues we are all facing as coaches and parents. https://theathletic.com/2930115/2021/11/02/bryce-salvador-on-battling-the-toxic-environment-of-youth-hockey-plus-the-impact-of-kyle-beach/ People have been suggesting that Mars should have refused to continue playing in that game. To be honest, I tend to agree with that assertion, though I'm not sure what I would have done from the bench there (except that I am positive I'd have walked over and talked to the Armstrong coach, especially given how easy it is to do so at Armstrong). This article is written about younger players, but by a former NHL captain who is now coaching youth. Whether you agree with everything in it or not, it's worth a read.

It was going to go national eventually: https://sports.yahoo.com/crowd-hurls-vulgar-sexually-explicit-chants-at-female-goalie-as-armstrong-mars-high-school-hockey-game-turns-ugly-224643179.html Hopefully this exposure gets these issues everywhere out into the open. As adults and coaches and parents we can't ever let this sort of thing go on. I can't wrap my mind around the adults in the rink, especially those who were there specifically to prevent this sort of stuff, not putting a stop to this. Just another in a long list of reasons to dislike playing at Armstrong.

Well I didn't see this photo, but if this is true, there's nothing more to say.

100% And, it should be noted, had the Armstrong coaching staff asked the security staff to do something, it's likely that they would have. That's why I blame the Armstrong coaches as much as anyone, personally. If they'd spoken up, as they SHOULD have, it probably would've been taken care of.

Worked? She made 35 saves despite the abuse. This goalie is plenty tough. This post is so off base it isn't worth talking about, but I'll say this: what we are talking about here is way beyond chanting a goalie's name. If you don't see how this is out of bounds, there's no helping you.

I cannot believe the guys from "On The Bench" are going to be there. That's just fantastic.

It's my understanding that a Constable was present at the game per the requirement - didn't someone mention that you can see him standing next to the student section somewhere above? This is an honest question because I don't know - was a PIHL official present at this game? My local school teams have had several where PIHL officials were not present. I am just wondering.

Officiating in that rink is always suspect in my experience.

Sadly this sort of thing is all too common in that rink. What world do we live in where anybody can think this sort of behavior is acceptable? I don't know what, if any, provision there is in PIHL rules under which the program could be sanctioned for this, but at the least they should ban spectators for high school hockey entirely in that noxious barn. They only have their own kids, and their own inaction, to thank for it. They're lucky there wasn't a brawl. I have a female player in my family and it would be hard to sit still for this sort of unfathomable behavior. Great parenting, Armstrong parents. My own kids would never leave the house again if they were involved in something like this.

I get that the very expensive organizations have an interest in not messing with the parents, but as for me, we never put up with that kind of behavior from parents. It's something that the coaches should be managing. Drunken misbehavior by the parents at games simply shouldn't be tolerated. But you see it all the time. I've seen parents getting into the faces of opposing players walking off the ice. Disgraceful.

Most of the rinks block school hockey practice sessions, too. The programs are allowed to ask them to. I have noticed that it pays to wait for games at Alpha. For games that start between half hours, like 9:10 PM, for instance, it's not at all uncommon for it to still be locked at 9:00 but unlock a minute or two before game time, or even shortly after the game starts. It's frustrating but if you keep trying you'll often get in to watch the games after all.

It's true that when we were kids almost everyone playing hockey had a dad who also played. The growth of the sport in Pittsburgh has made that a thing of the past. That's got some bad aspects to it, but it largely a very good thing. Keep in mind that the next generation of players will have the current generation as their parents. The explosive expansion of ice hockey in our region has made that impossible in the short run and inevitable in the long run. It's amazing to me that people think they don't ever have to be polite in grocery stores, on the internet, or at their kids' sporting events. Three tips for parents: The ref isn't going to give you calls just because you act like a jerk. If you're going to yell at least be right. Your kids HATE it when they can hear you yelling like a fool from the stands. It's embarrassing to them.

That was the plan according to the stuff they put out in the spring. I can't see it being ready unless they are just putting the final paint coats on the locker rooms right now. I just don't believe this will ever happen. I hope I am wrong.

You know, it has always killed my how many parents can watch their kids play for 10 years and still not understand what hooking actually is. Of course, it's possible they do understand and they're just whining...

Happy to hear you're still around!

As I have said above, the positions of those who support the rule change are well-reasoned. I don't think this rule change is cataclysmic, but I have the following reasons for disagreeing with it, some of which are good ones and some of which are not as good. In no particular order: There is no justification for allowing delayed offsides at the high school level but not allowing amateur players of that age delayed offsides. Let's all play the same game. While I agree that highly skilled players can perform a regroup and retain possession of the puck, @GrumpyOldPucker noted that the Russians tortured opponents with their regroups. Even their most skilled opponents couldn't do regroups like the Russians. Just because Makharov and Kharlomov could do this, should we expect all players to be able to? I don't know if I am on board with that. You do different sorts of regroups if Letang and Dumoulin are on the ice than if it's Ruhwedel and Maata. Coaches are free to coach their players to regroup in the neutral zone, and in this argument thereby dominate opponents at will, if they like, whether delayed offsides exists or not. I fail to see how removing an option from the game enhances creativity. It just requires everyone to play the game one particular way at all times. If coaches saw a huge advantage to the Russian style regroups, more teams would be playing that style now, even before the rule change. The fact that you don't see it being played that way already tells you something. We can, of course ,debate whether the coaches are correct in their perceptions here, but kids regrouped rather than dump the puck all the way through peewee under the old system because they didn't have delayed offsides, so coaching bantams to do it would have been trivial if a coach saw a way to gain a competitive advantage. Games I have watched this season have taken longer, and flowed less well, than they did last season. That may well - probably will - change as teams get used to the new rules. I'm not saying that hockey is better when players dump the puck rather than trying to do something more possession-oriented in the neutral zone, or even further back. I am saying that removing that option doesn't make the game better in my opinion, because there are isolated and possibly rare situations where dumping a puck makes sense. Again, maybe most or all of these concerns are going to lessen as players get used to this new rule. Maybe my biggest objection to this change is that touch-up offsides is just how hockey is played in my book, as a lifelong fan. But my first bullet is not going to fade away - if touch up offsides is bad for player development and bad for the game, why permit it at any level, or allow players to do it with their HS teams but not their amateur teams? The rules should be the same for everyone. Finally, for the record I think that not permitting a team on the PK is not a huge change. Although it can make it harder for the defending team to change (especially in the second period), in the games I have watched this season this rule change hasn't really been an issue. The kids have been aware of the the rule at HS and at amateur and generally acted appropriately. I still believe, though, that the rules should be the same for HS hockey as for amateur.

Goalie coaches especially are a highly individual choice. You can see that with goalies even at the highest level - NHL goalies frequently have issues when their goalie coach changes for some reason. You really need to take the time and talk to the coaches. Shane Clifford is a highly regarded goalie coach in the area, but there are others as well.

I don't disagree with what you said here, except that it's a matter of perspective. Whether a tournament is worth attending is a matter of what your goals are. I have found that going out of town for a tournament is a nice team building thing, and the kids (and the parents) generally have a great time. They're not a great way to find competitive games because they're hit and miss on that, and as we noted, you often end up playing someone you could have played at home. In other words, you don't go to a tournament as part of building your national bound or AAA resume. That's true. But there are maybe some other good reasons to go to them, for some teams. If my kids were on one of those "AAA" or "AA" teams our area seems to have such an abundance of on paper, I'd agree. They play so many games on those teams that adding a tournament seems silly.