Saucey

Get an agent! I don't know why you don't like or appreciate that advice...

Strength and size are still very, very important. But the game is changing. Exhibit A - Guenztel. If the game continues to move away from the goonery to skill, it opens up a little more for the super skilled small guy. Not by much, and the game hasn't decided what direction it wants to move to. And....those junior levels are still incredibly rough. A guantlet still to run. Connections, money, where you play. Luck. Few opportunities. Yep, it matters.

Did you get your kid an agent yet?

PAHL just set up something on their website as a clearinghouse for teams looking for players. I have never seen that before. It's a good idea....a lot of kids just won't play at 18u. Just not the same kind of play at that age. Talk about playing the same teams over and over..... maybe after AA at 18u a draft league isn't a bad idea. It's made for really close competition for the girls PIHL. And then you don't lose anyone who wants to still play.

I think you should get your kid an agent.

These are excellent events. Well run with good competition. There is way more exposure here for a kid who is not playing AAA, which is most kids playing high school hockey. There were college coaches occasionally in attendance, which I can't say ever happened with anything we ever did with travel. And they are way more fun to attend than any tournament we ever did through travel. The travel tournament is way overrated IMHO. All those games... it's only good for the rinks and tournament directors. Once they reach checking and a more adult stature, one game a day is all they should be playing. Takes a huge toll on their body.

How many Icemen players weren't brought over from NP is the better question. Only now they take the A kids.

2005 is 17 that is 18u. Many 04s off to college...not a lot of numbers to play.

And I would never recommend the Renegades. To each his own.

And also.... depends on your kid and what fits with your family. Practice times, etc

I would add Mt Lebo based on how they are to play against... typically parents and players are not jagoffs But I think they get hammered by one sheet of ice and all the chasers south. They don't retain good players. Maybe good at the younger ages?

That is my big beef with these programs. Even some AA teams will do this. Yes, A player, come sit the bench with us ...

I have no real opinion on Esmark. I always thought he was straight with parents on the talent level of their kid, though. His outfit will fold a team if it is not AAA and the parents don't want to proceed. Which is almost every year. ? So to me, that is completely the parents driving that boat. He will take the team and proceed if parents want, however. It's one reason I am not overly critical as I feel like there is straight talk there. Maybe it's different at the 16u level?

Some tournaments you go to, pretty sure a mailing list is created as same invites received by a lot of kids. NCSA profile that USA hockey partners with, we get all kinds of offers to spend our money there. High school exposure if your kid is good and playing for a big program, because there is press and the games are filmed/announced. If your kid has an Instagram account. Lots of ways once they reach a certain age. This is all the stuff that was 0 effort on our part. Some are tryouts. Some have camps. Some may invite you to a skate. Once your kid is old enough, you can reach out to coaches yourself if you want. It's like looking for a job. Except chances are, you are going to be spending money rather than getting paid. There was a good article on My hockey rankings that talked about junior hockey this past year if you are interested. The showcases and tournaments you can try. That all adds up, as well. The scouts for drafts and USHL/NAHL, they've earmarked kids playing top AAA or prep schools at age 14. They aren't looking at your kid playing Vengeance, Icemen, or independent AA or whatever. Vengeance's junior team is Tier III pay to play. Esmark feeds into a different Tier III pay to play. Different threads on this forum have talked about how many pierce high level college. (Not much at all, and not the levels I think most parents are thinking of when they start down this path.) I think it would be a good thing for parents to educate themselves early. To play a sport in college is different than I thought, but particularly ice hockey. I don't see anything wrong with playing Tiger III juniors in certain circumstances, so long as you understand that it is very expensive and it is about as likely to get you to NCAA Div I and the NHL as faux AAA. Or scholarship money. That's why the advice is to spend that money on actual college tuition. It's fairly normal for kids to take a gap year, even those not playing hockey. School is expensive. Let your kid mature a bit more. If they don't know what they want to study. But they need to take some classes, too. Basically...let them delay growing up if you want that. And, as always, get the grades, kids.

Listen....my kid is getting the same offers that the Icemen and the Vengeance are getting. Truly. Tier III pay to play juniors need bodies. He hasn't gone to a single showcase. We haven't paid for an extra A. Same opportunities. Dream killer? How about telling you it is completely unnecessary to play.... independent AA to do what those kids are doing. Faux AAA... They end up at the Same. Exact. Place. I mean, nothing changes over the years. After your kids come through, there will be another crop convinced it will work for their kid. Chase getting better in a good program. Good privates. Don't sweat it beyond that. If your kid has something, you won't need to chase. The right people will notice and suggest some other things to do. Ones without a team roster to fill.

Whoops quoted wrong thing. But it is true that even the pros do end up in beer league eventually.

I heard they had 100. ? I wouldn't get too excited, 07 is a low birth year. I doubt any team around here is going to look great.

Perfect. They'll be ready for beer league.

There are so many teams playing and not enough ice. That is what was explained to me about the length of the season. Split seasons have their issues, too. Travel programs end up playing their season in a compressed time frame in order to play enough games to qualify for Nationals. There really is no perfect way to do it.

Why ask a question I know you know the answer to? To never play in a game, how does that help? Why not get both practices and games? There are plenty of PAHL teams that offer both. This blanket assumption AAA programs sell, that PAHL doesn't offer enough, I challenge that. You can also...offer too much. Burn them out. Injure them. What kid wants to sit the bench all season?

This is exactly why I am so critical of these programs. The desire to chase and profiting from it, kid or parent. Many coaches will tell you being a fourth line player with few ice touches on a higher level team will not develop your player like playing the lower level will. Your kid does not need to go faux to develop. I have no trouble with the word no if I don't think it is going to work.

Lots of very defensive AAA folks. If you are allowed to spend your money as you want, I am allowed to believe that these programs are not good for my pocket book, bad for community programming and predatory towards families. And I can express that opinion. As can Danner. I have interest in hearing how the tryouts go. You don't... don't read the post. I know what they sell. I have been subjected to the sales pitches. The recruiting done directly to the child through social media accounts. The absolute nastiness displayed when you don't want to do it. (Name calling? Disparaging the very player they claimed to want not a few seconds before? You know who engages in that kind of behavior? The con man.) Be respectful of your choice to play AAA? Be respectful of mine not to do it. The 'benefit' of AAA programming sold is a fallacy. You do not have to have your kid on the ice 24/7 all year long to become good players. You do not have to travel all over the country. You do not have to have paid coaches. The amount of money and time spent is not directly related to the creation of a good hockey player. You don't even need to have a fantastic coach and squad every year. Your kid can still develop. I criticize because I feel like a parents' desire to give their kids the best and achieve their dreams is abused. I watch the chasers. I know their kid isn't going anywhere because they just aren't good enough. There is always somewhere for that child to land to continue chasing. WTF is that? You are allowed to say that is ok since it is their money, and I am allowed to say I think that is wrong. The comment about the PAHL travel...used to be all rec was in house. But parent demand was fed. Lots of things not good for the overall development of a player change because parents don't know any better. I don't disagree that youth hockey as a whole could stand to have less travel. Why are parents traveling hours to watch kids who can barely stand in their skates? ?‍♂️ Such babies on this thread. Man up and take the criticism without crying. Or wait...are these tears because people aren't lining up for the crap AAA programming this season like they were?

Hockey season starts so quickly, I can see doing it in spring. And the programs have ice to use.

Meh this board is used for gossip. Anonymous posting. ?‍♂️