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$4k tuition for a PAHL team….yikes

Really, "the ultimate consequence", actually that's incorrect. The lowest consequence for a spear is the call which was made, a 5 minute major and a game misconduct. The "ultimate consequence" escalates to a match penalty. Yes, "everyone in attendance was dumbfounded" might be correct because they were watching the play up ice as opposed to away from the puck. The rear official that made the call is 100% doing the job that he is out there for, which is to be especially vigilant for penalties which occur away from the play. Regardless of if the spear was "violent" or "soft", a spear is a spear.

This dude will never register to be an official, but he will stand outside the glass criticizing everything that he doesn't agree with. While the spear was "soft," it is still a spear, and thus, 5/game is correct call.

It's absolutely crazy. And I'm going to speak my own opinion here but it hurts the sport from top to bottom. Ever wonder why after pick 5 or so of the NHL draft it's a total crapshoot?

So we agree - it was a bad call 😂

AAAA is correct…at least from my non-analytical scientific data & information extrapolation techniques (*patent pending) that knows (at least what it once required) to make a legitimate Top 20 ACHA D1 school’s roster compared to now. The résumé’s of prospective ACHA D1, D2, or even D3 that step on the ice for tryouts today are so much more competitive (at least on paper, which could be saying something too). There’s surely marginal AAA players on weak a** cheese teams that barely play on the 4th line on their midget team coming in with nothing more than the third “A” on their hockey bag and nothing else to back it up. Then again, it’s *mostly politics we’re talking about here anyways. It always is, and such is life… Everyone can’t be naive to believe that hockey is immune to that caveat. Case in point: You got a recognizable hockey family name (that played in the NHL)? Bingo, you’re on the team! Or, in some cases it just takes some extra dough to grease the head honcho’s palms “for that little extra look-see” during tryouts to make sure he sees Johnny’s number. Its simply not an even playing field with a tight, vacuum-sealed lid on top where everyone could see and tell who was the best of the best. The consistently Top ACHA coaches will tell you where they recruit from. It’s not mostly juniors and seniors in high school like we see in other sports. It’s mostly Jr A. The bottom line that I’ve heard is: If you could take that same player either straight outta high school; OR, 1-2 years removed from HS (still as a freshman with 4 years eligibility), who are you gonna take? Considering my maturity level when I was 17-18 years old vs when I was at age 20…it was huge gap just in personal responsibility. There’s always outliers…but from the limited number of ACHA coaches I’ve talked with… it’s trending where they’re primarily looking Junior A as their recruiting base. I think that it’s crazy as well. But, it’s the reality of the situation.

This is what creates such confusion with fans, parents, and newer officals for that matter. There is a black and while rule book with clearly defined actions and options for penalties. However, there is "spirit & intent" of the rule that officials learn as they develop to higher levels. Officials who apply this "grey area" aka "game management" effectivly are able to move on to upper levels and probably the ones most want on their games. Unfortuantely, when it comes to playoff time, some of the early developing officals try to make a name for themselves or overthink calls. This is why you sometimes see off the wall penalties called in playoff rounds as opposed to the regular season. Also, USAH High-School Nationals were last weekend at Ice-Line in West-Chester. I suspect the officials working the games were in this mindset with national supervisors in the area. With possible national supervisors in the building, the ref may have made the call to show they have the "courage" to make that call in a big game...or out of "fear" that if they didn't make the call or call a lesser penalty, they may lose an opportunity to move on to a higher level. Again, the player opened the door and put the refs in the position to make a grey area call that 1/2 the people will always say was right and 1/2 will say was wrong no matter what reasoning is provided. By rule was it a "spear" ? - Yes. Did the action fall under "spirit & intent" of the rule? - No. Many times officials call half ass spears and "cup-checks" as slashing during the regular season, why change in the playoffs/championship? Could the ref have called slashing on this play (possible additional 10 min misconduct dependiing on how the game was going at that point), with high level coaches on each bench, in a close state championship game, knowing that GM's and Match penalties carry over to the teams after the player ages out, and nobody including supervisors would have been any the wiser? Probably, but they didn't, they went with 5+G (though I was told the call was a Match)

I'll just say I hope you are right but that's not what I'm seeing the trend being anywhere.

Make sure you don’t creep over that speed limit, take office supplies from work, or throw out someone else’s mail!

So the responsibility is on the officials and not the player.... got it. Here's the link, hope to see you out there soon: https://www.usahockey.com/officiatingprogramregistration

If you make that call on that play in a state championship, you deserve criticism. Officials in a game of that level should be experienced enough to use discretion. They delivered the ultimate consequence on an act that had no effect on a player or the game. Heck, I’ll willing to bet everyone in attendance was dumbfounded, and if no call was made at all there would have been no real complaint.

https://www.usahockey.com/officiatingprogramregistration

You make a lot of really good points. I also think Pittsburgh is a great place to live for hockey (youth and professional). My issues are with the sport as a whole. There aren't enough NCAA hockey teams. Compare it to almost any other sport as mainstream as hockey. Spots are very very limited. That creates this terrible system where kids move away to pay to play juniors at 15-16 years old and don't start college til 22 or 23. The whole thing is broken and a$$-backwards. The amount of money, time and commitment are insane. I also understand other sports are getting there as well. It's still not the same though. Jimmy from South Park playing football for his varsity team can still get recruited to play NCAA football way easier than little johnny and his aaa hockey team. The whole thing has become a money making racket and a game where you are really just funding people above you in the food chain. My remaining boy has no shot at all at an NCAA scholarship for hockey. I'm guessing he will end up playing club hockey at a high level. He is half the baseball player he is a hockey player and based on recruiting to date will probably at least play division III baseball. I find that insane.

This whole thread seems like it abruptly turned into Western Pennsylvania Youth Hockey’s version of “Grumpy old Men.” Frankly, it reminds me of a multi-generational commiseration of the “back-in-my-day” old farts sipping coffee and telling stories about how they should have listened to their mom & dad and played baseball (or football); instead wasting their childhood years and dreams by playing hockey in Pittsburgh…since, ya know…’nobody from Pittsburgh ever gets noticed, scouted, or goes anywhere.’ I can still picture so many people saying, “Sorry kid, you should have been born further north if you wanna play hockey…yeah, you gotta be from Canada, New England, Michigan, or Minnesota if you want to ever go anywhere in this sport.” It’s weird how there’s never any mention about how quickly this region has progressed from next to nothing as a legitimate hockey region—when discussed by all of the blue-blood and traditional North American hockey markets (i.e. Boston/New England, Buffalo/Western NY, Detroit/Michigan, Minnesota, Toronto/Ontario, Montreal/Quebec, even Western Canada). It’s truly included in those circles now and accepted as such when considering the talent pool of hockey players that come out of Pittsburgh…only not on par with their overall numbers, of course. Put it another way, it appears that Pittsburgh is way past the emerging hockey market problems. You don’t ever hear stories about people complaining about 5:00 AM available ice slots; only having 3-4 ice rinks available within an hour drive; or having generations of parents that never skated or played hockey and having to resort to being self-taught… or receive marginal hockey knowledge and coaching from guys that were only qualified because they were born in Canada or Maine.

Excellent points, that is what I was trying to convey. But logic doesnt override sour grapes.

The back referee is the exact person to make that call. That is why they are there. There is no way the low official could have seen the spear through the crowd. Again, doesn't matter what the intent was. USA Hockey is very clear on it. Any spearing motion is 5+GM at a minimum. Not exactly sure who that official was, but I am familiar with the process for assigning those officials. They are all very experienced.

Perhaps the kid said or did something in the course of the game that pissed the ref off, so he called something that otherwise wouldn't have been called? I've seen it happen before.

This was a big call at a big moment in a Championship game when the game was still close. I am surprised the refs made the call. However, it was clearly a spearing motion and the penalty for spearing is a 5 minute major and game misconduct. The problem with the rules is that it was such a weak contact and the other player didn't even flinch or react further to it and can't even tell if the TJ player actually made contact. So perhaps the "intent to injure" could be argued. The TJ player could have cross checked him back, slashed his leg, started a bit of a scrum or many other more severe retaliation options and still got away with a lot less penalty time and be able to play the rest of the game. Hopefully this is a good learning opportunity and a good teaching example for other coaches to discuss with their players in the future. I know I will include in future video sessions with my players as we discuss these topics.

While it wasn't the most vicious spear, when the player makes the spearing motion especially after the whistle he opens himself up to a spearing call. Downside here is if you call it spearing he has to get tossed. Giving the player a 2 and 10 for unsportsmanlike conduct probably send the same message without putting the team shorthanded for 5 minutes and tossing the player from a big game.

Are we sure that CV and PR actually won those games on Tuesday? It doesn't appear that the PIHL is certain. What's it take to upload some pictures? 8 minutes? Maybe 10. Each month it should become more and more apparent to all the haters what a great job John Mucha did as Commissioner. This sport could use more people with his passion AND his ability to work with just about everyone for the good of the game.

I didn’t say anything about beating the pens. Just because you play for the Pens elite doesn’t mean you are the going anywhere. Lots of Pens Elite players that never played more than ACHA. Others that haven’t played for Pens elite have gone on to higher levels. There is more than one path to higher levels.

If 2-4 players from every aaa team in pittsburgh except Pens elite (any birthyear) play free to play juniors or division 3 or 1 hockey I will salt my hat and eat it. Doesn't happen these days. If we are talking pay to play juniors whatever. I'd be absolutely shocked if it wasn't a couple pens elite, maybe 1-2 Esmark and 1-2 other kids across all the other programs.

Well if new kids don’t get a fair shake and they keep hanging on to kids from squirt until now then why would most even consider going there? You’re either there to place kids appropriately or run a good ole boys club. Can’t do both. It seems the latter will take priority in some places.