Theroadtobeerleague Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) On 5/11/2021 at 3:53 PM, sadday4hockey said: Brian Mueller was a Vice President of 200x85 and the Coach of the 2003 Chicago Mission. At that time there was no chance for PPE to beat them so........... they bought him and his star player whom just so happened to be the grandson of Rocky Saganiuk. Who is Rocky Saganiuk you ask? A former NHL player who also had a lucrative business in Chicago called Rocky hockey which was a great program and was 8U ADM before USA hockey joined the bandwagon. Rocky now oversees the Little Pens program and does a great job with it. Now back to the 6 figure coaching salaries. What number do you think it took to uproot these guys from their existing lucrative jobs and their families? Hint: there's a better chance it was 7 figures than 5 figures. PPE brought in $2.5 million in 2019 and ended the year wirh assets of $200,000. Can easily be looked up online on guidestar. However they don’t list thier top 5 paid employees. It’s hard to say where the money comes from for coaches and staff, with the blurred lines between Excel, PPE, and UPMC. But Excel high school program is $17,500, so they have the needed revenue to pay well. Edited May 13, 2021 by Theroadtobeerleague Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theroadtobeerleague Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 11 minutes ago, Theroadtobeerleague said: PPE brought in $2.5 million in 2019 and ended the year wirh assets of $200,000. Can easily be looked up online on guidestar. However they don’t list thier top 5 paid employees. It’s hard to say where the money comes from for coaches and staff, with the blurred lines between Excel, PPE, and UPMC. But Excel high school program is $17,500, so they have the needed revenue to pay well. If Mueller makes that much then why does he live in a townhouse in Cranberry? Also very easy to find online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forbin Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Not sure why you’re arguing with yourself.... but I’d be willing to bet that he lives in one of the newer $400k townhomes that are popping up all over the place up there. Which would make total sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaaahockey Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 I'm not sure anyone at PPE makes that much. Don't forget many of them get good salaries 50k+ but also have alternate jobs (scouting, sales, recruiting, etc) that double+ those salaries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danner27 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 2 hours ago, Theroadtobeerleague said: Exactly. Western PA produced a kid who is at the camp...exactly zero kids at that camp from ohio or eastern PA! That kid played AA through squirts. Don’t hate on a talented athlete that western PA AA and AAA hockey helped develop! You realize PPE has by far the most “evaluators” at the district camp ? A few years back kids from the PPE black teams were getting pushed through over players from other legitimate AAA programs in the district. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lifelongbender Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 8 hours ago, Theroadtobeerleague said: If Mueller makes that much then why does he live in a townhouse in Cranberry? Also very easy to find online. I know a few very wealthy people who have apartments in one city and permanent homes elsewhere. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theroadtobeerleague Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 9 hours ago, forbin said: Not sure why you’re arguing with yourself.... but I’d be willing to bet that he lives in one of the newer $400k townhomes that are popping up all over the place up there. Which would make total sense. People that make 7 figures don’t live in 400k townhomes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lifelongbender Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, Theroadtobeerleague said: People that make 7 figures don’t live in 400k townhomes Sure they do if their "real" home is a $10M mansion somewhere else, and the townhome is just where they're living during the season. You don't think that every single Penguins player has a home somewhere other than Pittsburgh? Lots of Penguins players have rented local homes from former players over the years. And what a shock - alot of those homes are in Mount Lebanon, right next to the rink they used to practice in frequently. That's why Kunitz, Dupuis, and Adams all had kids playing at Mount Lebanon when they played here. Because they lived in rented houses there. Despite the money they made. Of course he could be making 6 or 7 figures and live in an inexpensive home near the rink. That's just silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loach Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 12 hours ago, mrfreeze said: I heard at the 15u they cut 4 d, 1 goalie and 2 forwards, now I belive in addition 1 d and 2 or 3 forwars did not tryout. They took kids from LA, Dallas, Little Ceasers and a goalie from British Columbia. They also added 1 kid also from Pittsburgh, that went to play in the ccm 68 a year ago. The team has 3 kids from Pittsburgh if you count the 2007 that will play up with them most of the year, but not at mid am or nationals, the new kid they added, that never played there ever and 1 kid that has played on the team since first year squirts. The team will be good, some additions maybe better then some that did not make it, some won't. Some where guaranteed spots and the parent/s may be new staff members or skill instructors. Some of these kids have agents or influnce that helped them out. With this being said, it is hard to say they are great at development if you have 1 kid left after starting with this team from first year squirts, I would love to see if they are tracking any of this and any relitive data. Thanks for the reply. Regardless of one's stance on player development at PPE, this is pretty sobering information for parents of kids getting started in the program. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saucey Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 28 minutes ago, Loach said: Thanks for the reply. Regardless of one's stance on player development at PPE, this is pretty sobering information for parents of kids getting started in the program. Parents on that ride believe their kid will be the one not cut. ?♂️ Just like most of the ones who got cut will go to the next best 'AAA' option around here until they land. Some just opt to play high school hockey or, most sad in my opinion, give up hockey altogether. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockeyisgreat Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Loach said: Thanks for the reply. Regardless of one's stance on player development at PPE, this is pretty sobering information for parents of kids getting started in the program. Welcome to the real world. Nothing gets handed to you! Money might make it easier but in the end the best, most dedicated, hardest working rise to the top. In most cases where you start out has no bearing on where you end up because somewhere along the way the player decides how bad they want it and how hard they are willing to work for it. Nothing wrong with all that! It's life. I just don't like people who blame the organizations for wanting to be the best. Or catering to the demand for an extra A. It's law of supply and demand. From what I have heard there will be a lot of kids who tried out at the AAA level that didn't make it. If the worst AAA team next year turned away players then there is still a demand. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forbin Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 7 minutes ago, hockeyisgreat said: If the worst AAA team next year turned away players then there is still a demand. Agree with this to an extent. It has to stop somewhere though. Talking 14-18 age group I personally think that 6-8 teams per birth year (including PPE) in the Pittsburgh area is a fair number of AAA teams. That's <150 kids per birth year. I really see no problem with that. I know others here turn their nose up to it, but If it what players and parents want then its going to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatever Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) 12 hours ago, Danner27 said: You realize PPE has by far the most “evaluators” at the district camp ? A few years back kids from the PPE black teams were getting pushed through over players from other legitimate AAA programs in the district. My kid was on the black team a few years back and “pushed “ through as you would say at mid ams. That black team beat the gold team at districts that year. So yeah... maybe just maybe that black team kid earned his spot - both years he tried out. And, that Black team kid is currently playing in the NAHL . Edited May 13, 2021 by whatever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazedandconfused Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Back then, they were so intent on segregating the two teams from each other that they actually made the black teams wear a different uniform. A cheaper more suitable uniform for the dregs of the organization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danner27 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 2 hours ago, whatever said: My kid was on the black team a few years back and “pushed “ through as you would say at mid ams. That black team beat the gold team at districts that year. So yeah... maybe just maybe that black team kid earned his spot - both years he tried out. And, that Black team kid is currently playing in the NAHL . Not for the birth years I know, the black teams could not compete with the “elite” teams. I’m taking 99 down to 03. I’m pretty confident all the kids on those black bantam teams were all dumped by ppe going into U15, yet they pushed a good amount of them through the district camp. The Ohio Blue Jackets, along with Culver had a fallen out with mid am over this about 3-4 years ago. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatever Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Danner27 said: Not for the birth years I know, the black teams could not compete with the “elite” teams. I’m taking 99 down to 03. I’m pretty confident all the kids on those black bantam teams were all dumped by ppe going into U15, yet they pushed a good amount of them through the district camp. The Ohio Blue Jackets, along with Culver had a fallen out with mid am over this about 3-4 years ago. Nope - your memory is failing you right now. Looks like we were there around the same time. I believe the first year "black" teams were available were the 01's at the 14U level and those younger. My son also played 15U after his year as a "black" . So , nope he wasn't dumped. Made National camp 2x. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Django Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 hour ago, whatever said: Nope - your memory is failing you right now. Looks like we were there around the same time. I believe the first year "black" teams were available were the 01's at the 14U level and those younger. My son also played 15U after his year as a "black" . So , nope he wasn't dumped. Made National camp 2x. And he was always fun and exciting to watch. Well deserved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danner27 Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, whatever said: Nope - your memory is failing you right now. Looks like we were there around the same time. I believe the first year "black" teams were available were the 01's at the 14U level and those younger. My son also played 15U after his year as a "black" . So , nope he wasn't dumped. Made National camp 2x. I’m guessing it had to be an 03, my youngest is an 02. 99-03 are the BY i am most familiar with locally. I’m not doubting the stray kid here and there was retained at 15u, I do know of one 03 but then they dumped him at 16u. Kid is at Gilmour now. The point being many kids from the black team got pushed through the mid am camp by ppe over better players in the district, then dumped by ppe at midget. I could pm you 15 names alone from the 02 & 03 BY. Edited May 14, 2021 by Danner27 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatever Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 4 hours ago, Danner27 said: I’m guessing it had to be an 03, my youngest is an 02. 99-03 are the BY in most familiar with locally. I’m not doubting the stray kid her and there was retained at 15u, I do know of one 03 but then they dumped him at 16u. Kid is at Gilmour now. The point being many kids from the black team got pushed through the mid am camp by ppe over better players in the district, then dumped by ppe at midget. I could pm you 15 names alone from the 02 & 03 BY. Funny thing ... not our birth year but we ended up at Gilmour - by choice after 16u. Hated the coaching at 16 and it wasn’t looking too promising at 18. 16 was the last great year. The coach was not retained and he was the best. Took a black team at 14 and beat the elite at districts then took a 15 u to the semi finals at national. For whatever reason he wasn’t retained and we were no longer interested. You evidently passed through during those transition years with coaches and the mission statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danner27 Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 21 minutes ago, whatever said: Funny thing ... not our birth year but we ended up at Gilmour - by choice after 16u. Hated the coaching at 16 and it wasn’t looking too promising at 18. 16 was the last great year. The coach was not retained and he was the best. Took a black team at 14 and beat the elite at districts then took a 15 u to the semi finals at national. For whatever reason he wasn’t retained and we were no longer interested. You evidently passed through during those transition years with coaches and the mission statement. I think I know the story of this coach you are talking about if the time frame was before mueller or his first year - hard to recall. I honestly don’t recall any of the black teams beating the elite teams in districts but I do remember at one of the BY under my kids there was a lot of animosity between the black team & elite team, maybe the 03’s or 04’s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theroadtobeerleague Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 On 5/13/2021 at 8:19 AM, Lifelongbender said: Sure they do if their "real" home is a $10M mansion somewhere else, and the townhome is just where they're living during the season. You don't think that every single Penguins player has a home somewhere other than Pittsburgh? Lots of Penguins players have rented local homes from former players over the years. And what a shock - alot of those homes are in Mount Lebanon, right next to the rink they used to practice in frequently. That's why Kunitz, Dupuis, and Adams all had kids playing at Mount Lebanon when they played here. Because they lived in rented houses there. Despite the money they made. Of course he could be making 6 or 7 figures and live in an inexpensive home near the rink. That's just silly. Mueller lives here full-time in a condo. Fact. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lifelongbender Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 2 hours ago, Theroadtobeerleague said: Mueller lives here full-time in a condo. Fact. You win, man. I have no idea why you think that "fact" - if it is truly a fact - is relevant to the question of how much the guy makes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danner27 Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 8 hours ago, Theroadtobeerleague said: Mueller lives here full-time in a condo. Fact. He still has a house in Chicagoland along with Florida. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anon Posted May 15, 2021 Share Posted May 15, 2021 21 hours ago, Danner27 said: I think I know the story of this coach you are talking about if the time frame was before mueller or his first year - hard to recall. I honestly don’t recall any of the black teams beating the elite teams in districts but I do remember at one of the BY under my kids there was a lot of animosity between the black team & elite team, maybe the 03’s or 04’s. Bantam Major 2001 district 2015-16. Black beat Elite 3-1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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